2.1 Update Discussion

Hey gang,

Instead of posting to other threads, where possibly the information would be missed by some players, I thought I would collect a few recent questions into one discussion thread and give you guys some information from my point of view.

As will soon become repetitive, I need to stress that my thoughts are mine alone, and though I do have a voice in the planning discussions for game updates, I do not personally execute all of the changes, nor do I have any sort of 'veto' power.

I'll also add that I'm still very much the 'new guy'; I can't tell you what people were thinking when decisions prior to 2.1 were made, only to how we want things to go from here.

So, with that out of the way, here are some questions that have popped up recently:
1) When is update 2.1 coming?
Answer: Soon. The engineering and asset creation work is done, and we are in the "testing and approvals" part of the process. We can't give exact dates because we don't know if QA will find something that needs redressing, or if the build fails the approval process. We are hoping it gets to you in the next 10 days or so at most, but this assumes that everything goes well. If something does pop up that requires time to fix, we probably won't be making any kind of announcements here; we'll be working to make the necessary changes ASAP.

2) What's the deal with this Luck Nerf?
Answer: This is an idea that I fully support, and I know it is rubbing some people the wrong way. We made an error in announcing this change all alone, instead of including it with the list of improvements that we hope you guys will enjoy, and so it seemed like a piece of bad news in isolation with little justification.

Someone in the "Please explain the Luck Nerf" thread made a point about games with live content updates always needing to make adjustments so that future updates are possible. That hits really closely to what is going on here. We have plans for the future that will put a lot more focus on PVP, and so we want to make it as fair and rewarding as we can. Super-dodgy ninjas are going to look like a bug to players that don't know how to get that trick for themselves, and having only one viable defense strategy is dull. Luck is already one of the best traits in the game for the way it applies to lots of other traits, so limiting the number of valid combinations dampens the coolness of the breadth of that trait.

Because of the reaction of the forums, we've put an extra week of time from a lot of people into looking at this from all angles. A very strongly represented angle was that of the dedicated player that bought a lot of phones and upgrades building their team of Lucky Dodgers. I'll repeat that: the fact that the issue has been in the game for a while, and that lots of folks dedicated tie or money into pursuing this strategy is of very high concern for us. Whenever I see a "NG = greedy cash grabbers" replay, I feel frustrated too, and the "That's not how any of this works" commercial goes through my head. I assure you all that while we do have sales goals we are trying to hit, it is Next's mission to do that through adding good content and bringing in more players. Not at all by fleecing the ones we already have. We know that will lead to a game no one wants to play.

What does this mean in the long run? Yes, double Dodge + double Luck will be less good. Yes, there will likely be a build you can aim for specifically to reduce your PvP opponent's chances of getting a million dodges. We have looked at a way to implement this such that it affects PvE less, and I think we have a good answer. You will have a harder time against the very top levels of Challenge missions, though.

Upsides? We'll be able to get more people interested in a more fair PvP with better rewards, long term goals, fewer lopsided matches. We're planning for more, but I won't spoilt the surprise yet [it's a pretty ambitious goal, so if we can make it work, you'll definitely hear about it]. I think we can try to do a live event that gives more XP refund for scrapping stuff to help you build new setups faster in reaction to the change. And we're already planning to add more radio rewards and the free daily calls, so you should be able to bring in a new squad faster than before if you decide that you need a full overhaul. Lucky Dodgers should still be a viable setup after the change - just not the only viable setup.

3) 2 tokens for 10 or 15 radios is poop.
Answer: You're right. I'm paraphrasing, but it is certainly somewhere on the spectrum of poop - somewhere between "Late Night Fast Food Mexican" and "Forgot how old those leftovers were". I saved up phones for three days to make a ton of calls for Maggie, and got 18 in total. I think it's safe to say that player opinion in the office matches player opinion outside the office on that one, and we'll be doing something about it soon. That requires pulling up all the game data we can about the event we are just finishing now, comparing it to what we expected to see, and adjusting things [likely up] where they didn't match.

4) Other, bigger problems still exist... Why are we doing this now?
Answer: I'm hearing every week about something that was on the 'Honeydew' list for a while. Like the PvP disconnect issues, and the nagging reward failures for videos. Those kinds of things are getting addressed as we have engineer time to find and fix them. I'm sure I'll hear more, but if it would make you feel better to vent about your favorite [or least-?] issue, think of my Inbox as your personal soundproof screaming booth. Except that I will actually be listening.

That said, we're paving the way for a pretty big set of features in 2.2 [more on that as we get closer to the release] that we're hoping will welcome in a very large group of new and returning players. We're both patching up the paint and squeaky floorboards while simultaneously trying to roll out the red carpet and set out the fancy china for new guests. We're working on features that have implications for new and veteran players, and planning for the day we need to extend Max Council Level further than was originally planned. It's a ton of work, and we're trying to not add anything now that would need to be changed in a subsequent update. So I get that it may look like we're ignoring some long-standing issues, but it's part of the process of trying to make the game as exciting for everyone as possible all at once.

If you take any single message out of this long-winded post, I hope that it's one of perspective and concern. Next does look at all of the changes and improvements through the lens of the dedicated, veteran player, and try to anticipate your reaction. We do adjust those plans whenever possible to deliver the overall best game in the end. We are humbled by your choice to stand by us and want to do right by you down the road.

Let the comments begin!
Development Team Member - The Walking Dead: No Man's Land
Please note: Development is a fluid process, and suggestions and implementation take time and iteration. Any discussion of future features, deadlines, updates, balance changes, and such should be considered prospective and subject to change.
gabriel_lwh1RisblynknzNataNxyPutchucoMadPuppyTeeceezyPain WalkerRick_ZKtoby11781LightfeetSlowMoRankaRakyAmiga[Deleted User]JAZZZMANH_C_Rla_ll64l2wannabergerkmanMizTyMrsScattercushionalnodVudnikBill_ZRTSlickRickhottexasLadyAquilaantggbatsxyzbooshIRONDeeTroubleManPowerUKTheCrabmcbkhicksEL34xyzSAWMusatConan1976kennyszetoPrincess13AngieMathesonPapacasWallStreetSTODSYAmelyDegreaser[Deleted User]FacooCaptainslayerRoho59BuzzKillington


  • blynknzblynknz Member Posts: 1,988
    Thanks for the post @Shteevie
    I for one, am looking forward to the upcoming changes. I can see that it is needed for future enhancements (but please ensure it is fair for people who put money and time into the traits)
  • DIblisDIblis Member Posts: 729
    Thanks for taking the time to give us an update and your thoughts on things.
    Leader - The 75th Rangers

    Next Games - Quality Freemium Butchers - Purveyors of Fine Fresh Nerf - We Take the Luck Away From Choice Cuts

    Next Games - Great Leaders in Redefining Value in a Virtual World
  • Sipher07Sipher07 Member Posts: 591
    Appreciate this. But Brevity and concise language if you can please. Meaning Getting lost in the idioms and trying hard to be nice language
  • MadPuppyMadPuppy Member Posts: 2,831
    @Shteevie Best. Post. Ever. (From Next), though tbh, all this I got from your posts in you intro thread. :)

    @Sipher07 "We understand. We listen. Trust us. Now go and have fun."
  • RakyRaky Member Posts: 5
    I Hope They Will there be few events to help newby o:)
  • RankaRanka Member Posts: 125
    @Shteevie, thank you for taking the time to clear up the new trait system. I believe your infomation to the community does matter.

    Looking forward to face the pvp changes (guild vs guild??).

    /thumbs up.
  • RuthlessRuthless Member Posts: 42
    edited August 2016
    @Shteevie Nerfing dodge and luck is going to create a lot of backlash when it rolls out next update because many has invested a lot of time this past year and also money to build our survivors around it. Im not sure if a "scrapping event" will really make up for this nerf.

    I'm too tired to express the frustrations over this change as many has already said enough about it here on the forums..

    It just feels like you guys stabbed a knife through our hearts and i hope everyone else to please fight for these constant nerfs!
  • MadPuppyMadPuppy Member Posts: 2,831
    I say revenge on attackers & a Guild revenge list for those that are to tough to get back at yourself (limited to one time per attack to prevent bashing).
  • AmigaAmiga Member Posts: 3,770
    Is it too soon to write what adjustment, changes we can expect in update 2.1? I can't wait to see changes log!! ;)))
    <img src="http://i.imgur.com/d6070rs.jpg"alt="" />
  • Neil_JNeil_J Member Posts: 1,873
    edited August 2016
    Thanks @Shteevie for the info, however can you please add 'guys' and 'gang' to 'rad' as words to never use again.

    Thanks in advance.

    “You never know how strong you are until being strong is your only option.” (Bob Marley)
  • MadPuppyMadPuppy Member Posts: 2,831
    edited August 2016
    Educate me @Rick_ZK
    As I undestand it outposts is currently NML PVP per definition, right?


    We have plans for the future that will put a lot more focus on PVP, and so we want to make it as fair and rewarding as we can.
    a more fair PvP with better rewards, long term goals, fewer lopsided matches. We're planning for more, but I won't spoilt the surprise yet [it's a pretty ambitious goal, so if we can make it work, you'll definitely hear about it].
    There are a lot of people that do like PVP action, so I think it's logical that Next builds on that front as well.
    Doesn't sound as their main concern though, just as something that has consequences in various areas of the game.
  • SusanoRaySusanoRay Member Posts: 7
    Will there be any update to Heros? Currently they are disappointingly weak
  • Rick_ZKRick_ZK Member Posts: 296
    edited August 2016
    @MadPuppy Corrected. To me the luck nerf is an attempt from the devs to save outposts. Bullet dodge screwed up outposts even more, not luck stacking.
    IGN : Rick. Officer in the Cure Family. Number One in Sweden & currently 22 globally.
  • AmigaAmiga Member Posts: 3,770
    edited August 2016
    Luck power is most desire on high lvl walkers. How I play..
    1. Buy gas booster
    2. Start recommended lvl 30 walkers (map gas cost 12)
    3. Run from A to B hoping luck will work
    4. Repeat the process

    With respect but what for? There is no good rewards achieving more than 400 stars. Of course if somebody care about leaderboards.. but there is no rewards for it as well.
    Of course it affects mostly players paying for gas ect otherwise 12 gas per map is a big misunderstanding...
    <img src="http://i.imgur.com/d6070rs.jpg"alt="" />
  • ShteevieShteevie Staff Posts: 1,335
    -Autocenter is annoying, and seems to happen to me more on tablet than on phone. It's on my list.

    -The goal with PvP is to make the rewards good enough that you want to at least dabble. There are changes starting in 2.1 that I would be interested in your opinions on once the update launches. I'm also not a PvP-focused player, but if it's fun, I don't mind jumping in a little. However, challenge changes are also coming that will ease the tedium and increase the rewards. It's a "one thing at a time" method which makes sure that we get these things done at all.

    -In general, I think a preliminary change list is already out on these forums somewhere. Trade Shop, PvP changes, Free radio calls, and some mid-level economy changes are the very rough highlights of 2.1.

    -I have been reading up on the way people feel about Dodge and Luck, and I have lived it from your side as well. The sad part of the reality is that our data predictions can never be as extensive or as specific as the data we see from the players after launch. The other part is that each player sees their own viewpoint, which can be hard to reconcile with the broader range of experiences.

    One example is the radio call perception. Getting 2 tokens is a bummer, but in the averaging, the player that found around 5 tokens per call was quite happy with their results. But if we homogenize everything to a strict "5 tokens per call", the fun and excitement of the feature is gone. We're always going to look to improve the game towards that ideal of excitement and fairness.
    Development Team Member - The Walking Dead: No Man's Land
    Please note: Development is a fluid process, and suggestions and implementation take time and iteration. Any discussion of future features, deadlines, updates, balance changes, and such should be considered prospective and subject to change.
    NataNxy[Deleted User]Pain Walkerblynknz
  • AmigaAmiga Member Posts: 3,770
    I feel good step forward with update 2.1.
    I'm sure most of us will be happy even with luck thing...
    <img src="http://i.imgur.com/d6070rs.jpg"alt="" />
  • MadPuppyMadPuppy Member Posts: 2,831
    "Free radio calls"

    If that turns out well for me, I might feel encouraged to spend some radios out of my "hoard".

    Also inspired by the info about tokens being obtainable through other means than just radio calls. This would make me less dependant on the radio's and help me spend them easier.

    Right now the radio's feel like that piggy bank that I would never open unless for that ultimate toy. (I was always good at saving)
    I don't mind that the radios will likely become more relaxed for me.
  • l2wannabel2wannabe Member Posts: 546
    @Shteevie I'm just glad to see someone is listening and is concerned about the players especially the veteran players that have stayed loyal to NGs TWD. I have almost given up on PvP because players with survivors 3 and 4 lvls above my survivors just attack and take what I've worked so hard to accrue. It sounds like you guys have a plan and are striving to make the game more fair for all players. Thank you! Member of the Wrath and Fury guilds
  • S100200S100200 Member Posts: 97
    gas cost the challenges should be reduced, and lower levels need to be reviewed, beginning with challenges already pre classification as is done in outpost
This discussion has been closed.