Wrestling trait overpowered

Putchuco

This just in: like many of you I had built my team and all gear around luck+dodge+interrupt before v2.3.
These traits got nerfed big time (maybe a bit too harsh and without any warning, but that's another story).

Try nailing me to the cross if you must, but the game got better by toning down these overpowered traits.
The game had become a simple 'run and dodge' game on many maps (if that's a category

@Shteevie @Teeceezy
A similar thing is happening right now with the wrestling trait IMHO.
I'm finding myself (and all my guildies) pretty much wrestling through the high levels, with the occasional lucky spawn in some missions (which prevents us from wrestling). This got boring very, very quickly. I don't think this game should be reduced to one single trait and all strategies tailored around it, same as it did with interrupt+dodge. NML turning from said 'run and dodge' game into a 'wrestling game'.

Any armor without gold wrestling trait is pretty much a wasted armor, and that in itself proves that it is overpowered.
As briefly touched in the thread about 'low-level survivor loophole', toning down the wrestling trait might very well render the LLS obsolete.
Two birds, one stone kinda thing.

BTW, I am seeing a 100% success rate with wrestling armor in the first round, have never seen a delayed or failed wrestling (with gold trait), but maybe I am wrong and I overlooked it.

(Let's pls keep this discussion civil, I mean no harm to anyone, but want to progress the game. Think about it, do you really want to repeat mission after mission, round after round only wrestling walkers?)

capibara

May i suggest to quit the rankings?

JackBauer

Wrestling trait should just work same as body shots or as no dodges happen against higher opponents.
NG even don't need to write new code.

Jaden

Is this a spin-off of the LLS loophole thread?

Squall_NML

Talking about wrestling, may i suggest to summon "The Rock"

If You Smellll, what The Rock is Playing

capibara

Yep as said @szgerg77 there are probably 200 players worried about that (less for sure...). How many ppls are playing NML @Teeceezy ?

Putchuco

Interesting takes on the subject here.
I would kindly disagree that an overpowered wrestling trait is a 'problem for the 1%'.
Anyone pushing their limits, no matter what lvl, will run into this and be forced to tailor their armor and then their strategy to be based on wrestling. It is simply out of balance with the rest of the game, and needs to be reeled in IMHO.

BTW, if you have gotten used to use wrestling only to push your boundaries, the new spiked walkers will provide a true challenge

DangerB

My favorite was the The Hulkster. But I don't think he was always overpowered. Only at the end.
Only when he went all Hulkamania and gave you that stare, then you knew it was all over.
I am a real American, Fight for the rights of every-man

JayZ

Non-competitive player perspective here: please don't nerf Wrestler. I only just started investing in armors with the Wrestler trait, and have found it to be useful but not overpowered. On the last challenge, it helped me squeak by some of the tougher missions to complete a round (albeit with a lot of hospital time and only one star), which I believe was the designed intent of the trait. My general preference is to avoid hospital time as much as I can, because I hate paying gold to heal.

Now, if the Wrestler trait is bugged (e.g., 100% success rate, like Stun Resistance was a while ago), obviously the success rate should be corrected. However, a trait shouldn't be nerfed because a few competetive players decide they don't like wasting their weekends wrestling through high level missions. That's your gold, your gas, and your time. If you don't want to wrestle through missions, don't punish the rest of the player base who use the trait as intended. If your beef is with players using LLS with wrestler, than focus your energy on ways to fix the LLS exploit (e.g., scale hospital time to player, and not survivor, level).

The "NG's decisions should revolve around me because I care about the leaderboard" attitude is honestly kind of sickening. Go outside this weekend bro. The weather is supposed to be nice in most parts of the U.S. (if that's where you're from). Spend some time with your family and friends (if you have any), instead of complaining about things that affect 1% of the player base.

DLich

Silver Wrestler is 40% chance
Gold Wrestler is 60% chance

Gold Luck on a weapon is 20%
lvl 6 Luck on a survivor is 20%

Silver Wrestler trait would be 40% + 16% = 56% chance to kill a walker you're struggling with during your turn
Gold Wrestler trait would be 60% + 24% = 84% chance to kill a walker you're struggling with during your turn

I don't use the wrestler trait and in my opinion based on the way I play the game I find it to be a wasted spot. I'd much rather prefer to have Iron Skin, Dodge & Stun Resistance on my armor. Doesn't the Wrestler Trait only work once per survivor? I mean a survivor can't go through wrestling with every walker he comes across. Once he's red that's it right? I learned last week in some other thread about freemen strategy regarding how they get into struggles and assume it works similarly with our own survivors.

Stun Resistant has 75% chance with gold & if you factor in Gold Luck and a lvl 6 luck survivor trait it's over 100% chance (75% + 30% = 105%).

We all play the way we want to play within the rules established within the game. It's frustrating to see players whom are part of a community pleading a case to the developers that something someone else does isn't fair and this goes for everything.

I play a lot of outposts and have grown tired of wasting gas and time to have someone block the crate so a player I know created a spreadsheet of names of outposts to avoid and now I save time and gas avoiding those. Every so often I come across a new name to add to that list and once you're on it it's unlikely you'd be removed. When I refer to "YOU" here I don't mean anyone in particular other than players whom make it impossible to get the crate in one move.

Anyway i'm delving off topic and not my intention. We all use strategies to play the game the way we like. Our survivors look different, the traits they have are different, weapons and armor are different, play style are different, everything is different.

If the 12.5K TG crate that's usually always offered continually gives me 3 perfect traits every time I purchase it I wouldn't tell the forums it's overpowered. If I saw someone else and/or most other people getting perfect traits every time from that same crate and I'm over here getting Interrupt, Silenced & Destructive on a pistol I wouldn't think the 12.5K TG crate is overpowered.

I have no beef with anyone here nor am I looking to create any. This is an online game that we play for fun. When fun becomes critiquing how other people play the game because we think they should be playing it the way we do I think we need to look at what we find as "fun".

I do not care about the leaderboards
I do not care about spending money to have the best gear and survivors
I do not set alarms when gas has replenished or TG shop has restocked
I do not buy unlimited gas everyday of the week to maximize stars

I am not bothered by those that do... If that is their definition of fun then so be it; more power to them.

I do hope everyone can have fun and NG can make this game fun again. They already did that "in my opinion" with 2.4 and challenge 2.0.

I think everyone should stop and look at the flowers

capibara

When i start wrestling i know that my run in the challenge is ending and i quit. I have already enough wrestling in real life...

Putchuco

JayZ said:

The "NG's decisions should revolve around me because I care about the leaderboard" attitude is honestly kind of sickening. Go outside this weekend bro. The weather is supposed to be nice in most parts of the U.S. (if that's where you're from). Spend some time with your family and friends (if you have any), instead of complaining about things that affect 1% of the player base.

I had wished we could've stayed away from lines like this and keep it civil.

ATLAS-Z

@Shteevie @Teeceezy

Here you go...

Gold wrestler
(Survivor level / walker level ) x 60%

Silver wrestler
(Survivor level / walker level ) x 40%

Bronze wrestler
(Survivor level / walker level ) x 20%

bladgier

Struggle was useless. Cry about it.

Struggle is useful. Cry about it.

Geez people make up your minds.


Dodge and interrupt nerf was indeed a very painful thing for us, we agree on that1.


But at least we were given a chance to come up with new tactics with traits which were useless before.

It also refers in a way to the TV series where struggle indeed is a chance of living or not, whichever walker it would be.

I couldnt disagree more of wrestler below golden being useless. I ve been working on brown and silver most of the times and they work. Often they dont. I cant see it being OP because numbers of reasons with the strongest reason being injured heavily and getting 1 star.

David_H79

You know about the tactics with wrestler.
You don't like it.
Don't use it.
How easy is that.

Please don't try to demand all other players how they have to play this game.

CRUSH

Squall said:

Talking about wrestling, may i suggest to summon "The Rock"



If You Smellll, what The Rock is Playing

"The Rock" with a sock as special weapon. If you smell, how the sock is...

CRUSH

It's definitely overpowered, but goooooooood.
Oops, where is the video clip?

srmcn1031

I really don't see the big deal in a player finding a way to take down high level walkers with the wrestler trait. If they do decide to nerf that then players are just going to find another way of beating high level walkers. It's not an exploit, it's just strategy.

Verbaub

Using the Wrestler trait means you're automatically only getting 1 on the mission. I don't really see how that is OP. Haven't we had enough traits nerf'd at this point?

DLich

This is what happens when you combine Gold Stun with Gold Wrestler Trait

Gebobs

I honestly don't know how folks can do 1000+ stars in a challenge. Aside from all the gas it takes, it takes a LOT of time. I get to about 800 stars and that requires as much commitment to the game as I can give, probably too much. And on top of that, it gets pretty boring doing the same six missions over and over and over again.

Personally, I can't be bothered with all the detail on the traits. All my gear is legendary and I'm just fine trying to max out their level. I'm not going to be worried if this trait is better than that one. If my survivors get clobbered because of it, so be it.

Putchuco

@Verbaub and others, 're-balancing' is the word I would use here.
Having wrestler trait kick in and give you an option to gain a star that you cant win otherwise, super.

But, wrestling trait is bugged, it works 100% of the time and it isnt supposed to.
Secondly, just by wrestling we can roam through almost all missions and rounds endlessly, only limited by gas, time and gold for healing.

The introduction of the spiked walker is a good addition to fight this boredom and single-minded strategy.

David_H79

@Putchuco If you only mean that the chance is 100% instead of 20/40/60%, then this thread has to be moved to the Bugs section.
So the developers can have a look at it.

Putchuco

@David_H79 , it is both: It doesnt work as intended and advertised and it is unbalanced.

DLich

@Putchuco I have a lvl 23 Ragtag scout weapon with silver interrupt (80%) on a 6 star scout with lvl 6 luck (20%) and when I add the two it's 96% chance of interrupt. I use him in outposts vs lvl 19 opponents (normal, armored, tank) and it goes off so often that when the 4 out of 100 times it doesn't go off is so seldom that I often forget it's not 100%.

I'm not saying your experience isn't valid, if the issue is that it's going off 100 out of 100 or even 1000 out of 1000 times then yes it should be brought to the bug section. Otherwise as I mentioned above if you have -

Silver Wrestler is 40% chance
Gold Wrestler is 60% chance

Gold Luck on a weapon is 20%
lvl 6 Luck on a survivor is 20%

Silver Wrestler trait would be 40% + 16% = 56% chance to kill a walker you're struggling with during your turn
Gold Wrestler trait would be 60% + 24% = 84% chance to kill a walker you're struggling with during your turn

It's not far off that if it's 84 out of 100 times it should average going off, that if you have it go off 30 times in a row it could be misconstrued as "always" working. If it hadn't gone off 30 times in a row I would absolutely think there's an issue.

Jaden

Might I bring up the suggestion again that we all get the same survivors, gear, XP, supplies and stars... I mean... that would be completely fair and balanced, no?

Maybe we can also add forced autoplay with no way to do something differently from the way others do it. That would eliminate those pesky different strategies people develop.

Putchuco

@Dlich, totally agree on your numbers.
Have you EVER seen a gold wrestling NOT kill a W in the very first turn? Anyone else?
My perception is even without any luck the gold wrestling kills ALL the time in the first round.

TheLostOnes

I can't wait for tomorrow's thread.

Will it be: please remove the overpowered assault charge? Or please remove the overpowered defensive stance trait?

Teeceezy

TheLostOnes said:

I can't wait for tomorrow's thread.

Will it be: please remove the overpowered assault charge? Or please remove the overpowered defensive stance trait?

Or "Please remove the overpowered moderating team"

WeekOne

Hi @Teeceezy I love that comment... Can I create that thread? Lol

OK... I'll hopefully be out of the forum jail on March 6th for good behaviour *wink*