I'm disappointed this thread isn't specifically about penis....... But yay for relevant topics, I guess lol
While I like a penis thread as much as the next habitual thread derailer (I contributed significantly to a chain of events in the Forum Flair thread that lead to its closure) what I appreciate about this thread is that there is consistent, sustained feedback on this topic, there are clear, logical arguments that describe why the current system has some flaws, and there are multiple well thought out alternatives presented that would eliminate the flaws of the current system (@Gindy, that Oxford comma is for you). I should also say that I'm happy that most of the comments here are constructive and there's very little flaming and jackassery.
The fact is there is still a clear disadvantage to upgrading your survivors due to the increasing starting RSL and Repeat RSL formulas. This is most obvious when a player upgrades their first 3 survivors to a new level and before they have 'caught up' with their gear, but this problem persists for weeks and weeks and even months until they're finally 'caught up' with having the vast majority of their survivors and gear at max level.
With the several options to address this issue, I hope that NG has or will soon move on from 'monitoring' this issue to actively working to eliminate it. But the best way to have an impact on helping this get addressed is to continue to post to this thread so there's no mistake that we haven't 'gotten over' or accepted this issue.
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@RedEye52 it's only been like this since challenge 2.0 not always. I'm not sure how they can fix the issue, I'd be fairly happy if rsl starting lvl and triple lvl changed with every 2 lvl upgrades rather then every single one
@RedEye52 It was the combination of challenge 2.0 and the addition of a max level that was never originally intended that introduced the star penalty for upgrade in this game.
I'm as frustrated as everyone else with this, but I did some digging into this using @JayZ's numbers along with OLT's website and came up with a rather interesting result to try to explain why the issue with 20 & 21 and if I should upgrade my survivors to 22.
The end result is it looks like level 20 survivors just happen to land in a "sweet spot" when it comes to getting to 1000 stars due to the way the challenge is laid out along with survivor damage vs walker health just happens to be a benefit for those at 20.
So, what this shows, is the last 5 levels that are needed to get to at least 1000 stars for 18, 19, 20, & 21 level survivors. I compared the walker health against hunter damage (legendary survivor & maxed legendary weapon). The fifth one (the 21 w/23) is the transition point of having 21 survivors with maxed 20 gear since we didn't have a lot of time to get 21 level gear and max it. Rather interesting differences in Walker Health vs Hunter Damage and how the lowest value is at level 20 but higher at 19 and 21.
.
I did not take into account pink stars or traits, but I think at this point this is a decent theory on at least part of why those staying at 20 have it easier in the challenge. I could be entirely wrong on this, but I suspect this is at least part of the answer to why.
If we look at the chart DLich put together on RSL, 11 hits 1000 at 23, 12 at 24, 13 at 25, but 14 also hits at 25, and 15 at 26. I suspect that since 13 & 14 both hit 1000 stars at level 25 walkers, that pause in the step up is contributing to this whole issue. RSL 2 & 3, 5 & 6, 9 & 10 also share walker levels but those at that level are working on maxing their camp and getting to a higher level so probably just ignore the drop in stars as a cost of leveling up.
This also shows what a disadvantage the current trigger for higher RSL causes you due to lack of good gear and I think also lends credence to @WeekOne and her thread about the need for NG to start dropping 23 & higher gear now just like it is done at lower levels.
I'm not sure; I think he was cowed by your incredible wit, originality and complete lack of trolling. NG must have nerfed his forum account lolroflmao smiley face. Maybe he needs to clear his cache ha ha
@Captainslayer@paintbeast Maybe for challenge stars, but that's not what I said. Go read my post again before you correct me.
We have always had the temporary disadvantage after leveling up survivors. You all are specifically complaining about the challenge (and rightly so), but it also affects scavenge missions and season missions, for example. But you can also see an immediate benefit, even without new gear, on story mode or outposts. But it's still not new.
Challenge 2.0 definitely made it worse, and much more obvious, sure. But it was always there.
@RedEye52 I see your point but I suppose I never thought it was even a temporary disadvantage when scavenge missions went up a lvl in fact I didn't even notice they went up until someone on the forum pointed it out
We are told that levelling up our survivors and armours is to our advantage yet we keep being penalized for doing so.
When competing, a 76 star handicap per player is a big deal.
When an entire guild decides to only level up 2 survivors to lvl 22, this gives them a total of 1,520 stars advantage over a guild who decides to trust that NG is speaking the truth.
This handicap makes it that much more harder to compete and is 100% unacceptable or fair.
We should NEVER, EVER, EVER be penalized for upgrading or levelling anything and why it’s the other way around is.... I have no positive words for this!
How much more do you expect or think loyal/trusting players will continue to endure this?
Currently, at RSL 30 and above, it's 4 tier repeatables, instead of the usual 3 tier repeatables. What if they were to move the 4 tier repeatable down to +6 (or whatever) of the maximum survivor level possible. Pre 2.6 with level 21 survivors being the max, the 4 tiered repeatables would have started at RSL 27. Post 2.6 with level 22 being the max, 4 tiered repeatables would start at RSL 28. If NG chooses to upgrade the council again and introduce level 23, it would start at 29 and so on. This way there would be an incentive to upgrade to the max level survivors because all things being equal (survivor stars, gear, traits, etc) a lower level survivor cannot get as far as a higher level survivor due to the health/damage advantage as well as the body shot problem. A player with max level survivors (22's currently) is going to have an easier time getting to those extra tiered repeatables and the extra stars they could produce. Just a thought.
Well, I have felt the handicap this week in the challenge. PB last week when starting the challenge with no lvl 22 survivors. This weeks challenge I started with 4 and I'm 100 stars down on last week with better survivors!!!
Well, I have felt the handicap this week in the challenge. PB last week when starting the challenge with no lvl 22 survivors. This weeks challenge I started with 4 and I'm 100 stars down on last week with better survivors!!!
So you upgrade and have to work harder to compete.... WOW!
@Bosshogg don't you read the forums much? If you did, you would know upgrading is a bad thing
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Daaamn! I don't agree that players with survivors lvl 20 and only 2 survivors lvl 21 have 106 stars bonus, but players with over 3 survivors lvl 21 are penalized with 106 stars.. Players with 2 survivors lvl 21 use same damage and health as players with 3 survivors lvl 21, buuut 3 survivors don't have 106 stars as 2 survs lvl 21. I want ca NG remove these stupid "cheats" and immoral 2 survivors lvl 20/21/22... because this ruin loyalty and normality for players with 3 survivors lvl 21 and 22. Some players cannot to unlock some heroes because they keep 2 survivors lvl 21 for bonus star in challenge illogical. This is so unfair and illogical.
Can we get a confirmation from @Teeceezy and @Shteevie that this is an immediate concern and that they are actively working on a solution? All I'm seeing is a lot of "thanks for the feedback" which just comes off as a smile and nod.
From table result you so more penalized at survivor lvl 22, even lvl 21. You spend so much time, XP, TG for searching gears lvl 24, 25, but you cannot to have more stars than 2 survivor lvl 21 & 1 surv lvl 20. It's need to remove this stupid formula with 2 survs lvl x+1 & 1 surv lvl x because they have stars saved/kept, not penalized as 3 survs lvl x. And this is very unfair and immoral.
I will put this out again: make it the rounded average of all survivors. That way we can upgrade enough survivors to trigger the higher level of goods in the trade shop without penalizing us in he challenge. This also gives us a chance to upgrade gear so when we do move up RSL, we are at or very close to what we were before in capability.
My camp is currently maxed. Number of 22 survivors: 0. Number of survivors planning on upgrading: 0. Number of heroes I will unlock: 0. All because of the way advancing RSL is determined and the penalty incurred.
I've upgraded just one survivor to level 22 and now it's touch and go whether I can get through hard scavenge missions (rsl is now 26). Two missions tops and then I'm in the hospital for 2 hours.
I am planning on upgrading all of them when I have great equipment for everyone I use. I have two at lvl 22 right now but I am working on equipment for the rest. At that point I know I may lose a few stars but not as bad as if I upgraded in the beginning with no equipment.
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The fact is there is still a clear disadvantage to upgrading your survivors due to the increasing starting RSL and Repeat RSL formulas. This is most obvious when a player upgrades their first 3 survivors to a new level and before they have 'caught up' with their gear, but this problem persists for weeks and weeks and even months until they're finally 'caught up' with having the vast majority of their survivors and gear at max level.
With the several options to address this issue, I hope that NG has or will soon move on from 'monitoring' this issue to actively working to eliminate it. But the best way to have an impact on helping this get addressed is to continue to post to this thread so there's no mistake that we haven't 'gotten over' or accepted this issue.
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I'm not sure how they can fix the issue, I'd be fairly happy if rsl starting lvl and triple lvl changed with every 2 lvl upgrades rather then every single one
The end result is it looks like level 20 survivors just happen to land in a "sweet spot" when it comes to getting to 1000 stars due to the way the challenge is laid out along with survivor damage vs walker health just happens to be a benefit for those at 20.
So, what this shows, is the last 5 levels that are needed to get to at least 1000 stars for 18, 19, 20, & 21 level survivors. I compared the walker health against hunter damage (legendary survivor & maxed legendary weapon). The fifth one (the 21 w/23) is the transition point of having 21 survivors with maxed 20 gear since we didn't have a lot of time to get 21 level gear and max it. Rather interesting differences in Walker Health vs Hunter Damage and how the lowest value is at level 20 but higher at 19 and 21.
.
I did not take into account pink stars or traits, but I think at this point this is a decent theory on at least part of why those staying at 20 have it easier in the challenge. I could be entirely wrong on this, but I suspect this is at least part of the answer to why.
If we look at the chart DLich put together on RSL, 11 hits 1000 at 23, 12 at 24, 13 at 25, but 14 also hits at 25, and 15 at 26. I suspect that since 13 & 14 both hit 1000 stars at level 25 walkers, that pause in the step up is contributing to this whole issue. RSL 2 & 3, 5 & 6, 9 & 10 also share walker levels but those at that level are working on maxing their camp and getting to a higher level so probably just ignore the drop in stars as a cost of leveling up.
This also shows what a disadvantage the current trigger for higher RSL causes you due to lack of good gear and I think also lends credence to @WeekOne and her thread about the need for NG to start dropping 23 & higher gear now just like it is done at lower levels.
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I'm not sure; I think he was cowed by your incredible wit, originality and complete lack of trolling. NG must have nerfed his forum account lolroflmao smiley face. Maybe he needs to clear his cache ha ha
We have always had the temporary disadvantage after leveling up survivors. You all are specifically complaining about the challenge (and rightly so), but it also affects scavenge missions and season missions, for example. But you can also see an immediate benefit, even without new gear, on story mode or outposts. But it's still not new.
Challenge 2.0 definitely made it worse, and much more obvious, sure. But it was always there.
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We are told that levelling up our survivors and armours is to our advantage yet we keep being penalized for doing so.
When competing, a 76 star handicap per player is a big deal.
When an entire guild decides to only level up 2 survivors to lvl 22, this gives them a total of 1,520 stars advantage over a guild who decides to trust that NG is speaking the truth.
This handicap makes it that much more harder to compete and is 100% unacceptable or fair.
We should NEVER, EVER, EVER be penalized for upgrading or levelling anything and why it’s the other way around is.... I have no positive words for this!
How much more do you expect or think loyal/trusting players will continue to endure this?
Two words: FIX IT!
GOOD JOB NG!!!!
It’s a god damm lost cause with them. Holy Fuck!
Sorry... it had to come out.
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PLEASE FIX this UNFAIR score stars challenge.
From table result you so more penalized at survivor lvl 22, even lvl 21. You spend so much time, XP, TG for searching gears lvl 24, 25, but you cannot to have more stars than 2 survivor lvl 21 & 1 surv lvl 20. It's need to remove this stupid formula with 2 survs lvl x+1 & 1 surv lvl x because they have stars saved/kept, not penalized as 3 survs lvl x. And this is very unfair and immoral.
My camp is currently maxed. Number of 22 survivors: 0. Number of survivors planning on upgrading: 0. Number of heroes I will unlock: 0. All because of the way advancing RSL is determined and the penalty incurred.
I hope we can change that.