I got wet just reading that. Because I spilled my Lagunitas IPA on my pants. Because it got me a little excited. Now I have to grab a towel, or a nearby sock, and rub my jeans dry.
At least the free spear from upgrading Carol will be level 24. People would have gone off if it was obsolete immediately. Guess I can forget about upgrading all my survivors to 23. Gotta get my mains to 24. Whats that gonna be? 3 million each and 6 months of work? GRIND, GRIND, GRIND...
@Kaz@Shteevie So you're going to refund all of the weapon bundles sold to all players since @Kaz announced that there would not be a council upgrade in 2.10 (and so we should spend our money on weapons)?
It would seem that all of those refunds would seriously cut into the profits made from the council upgrade.
Personally I did not purchase any weapons, but I reported to the two guilds in my guild family that there was going to be no council upgrade in 2.10 and it feels fucking awful to have passed on the info that they would have at least a while to use those weapons/gear before an upgrade in council, and this is true for many, many other people.
Haven't read the whole thread so I don't know if this has already been addressed. If I am reading things right, the new challenge settings will basically make it near impossible for anyone with level 20 or 21 characters to reach 4 bonus passes. 5 passes are pretty much out of the question. Would have to make it to challenge level 28 to even get to 4 passes Why if they were cutting the amount of rounds for each level, did they not cut the amount of rounds needed
It won't be 24 unless you have a scout to 24 before claiming it, assuming it works like every other weapon gift in game.
Just need council lvl 22 (which was upgradable in 2.8 I believe). Don’t need a lvl 24 scout. Just need council lvl 22. Don’t even need to be camp lvl 67.
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That sucks man. I know a lot of players who aren’t gonna get it because of the same reason. I think ng has a great idea with this but sucks that those like yourself who had her a legendary are “punished”
I’ll be the first to say, in anticipation of them running this again for a different hero I don’t plan to make any other heroes legendary again unless there’s a benefit for it like the kingdom spear. I was one of those in a sweet spot. Needed 150 tokens. Got them easily. Without spending a dime. I’m fortunate. Others aren’t.
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It's a disappointment that I can't get it. But not something I will dwell on too much.
More disappointing is the council level announcement. I would have taken it in stride if it were announced as part of 3.10. But to randomly drop it 2 weeks later after explicitly stating there would be no council increase? That's crap.
> @Samstown said:
> So based on the fact you guys lied about the council upgrade and told us it was safe to buy weapons and gear are you going to refund us since there now crap and out dated? You guys really cheated a lot of people. You guys need to make it where weapons can just keep leveling up.
Quoting and bumping in the interest of truth. They lied. They made sales on those lies. In American business that’s called “Bait and Switch.”
“Simply put, there’s a vast ocean of sh!t you people don’t know sh!t about. Rick knows every fine grain of said sh!t.”
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@DLich I've long come to the conclusion that +XP Events are not ideal, at least not for Boosters, unless you're VERY gold rich, or have no problem unloading $$$$.
You too quickly get maxed out on XP and have to spend a fair amount of gold to push buildings and take advantage.
Now a DOUBLE EVENT with x2 XP AND 5 sec upgrades??? That's ideal. Take my $1.99 every time.
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So, do we never upgrade another “hero” in advance, because there might be another “event week” like that for Carol? Do we never spend another Tomato because NG might be LYING about Council upgrades? Don’t spend another phone because of some random, unannounced 40 call event that might appear? I’m so confused. I really thought communication was getting better with @Kaz, was I wrong?
“Simply put, there’s a vast ocean of sh!t you people don’t know sh!t about. Rick knows every fine grain of said sh!t.”
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Everyone might want to take a second and remember that @Kaz is just the messenger here. I highly doubt it was his decision to do a council update next week. I believe he was not trying to deceive the player base with his earlier proclamation of no council update with this release This decision came from the executive ranks at NG.
Just hypothetically, if a gaming company who whose stock was traded on the public markets, needed to bolster their first quarter financial results, might they consider doing what they knew would increase sales? NG knows that a council update in this game gives them a quick, short-term boost in sales based on their past updates. And they are using it now 30 days before the end of the first quarter, similar to what they have done in part quarters.
Until NG has other games producing revenue, I personally would expect to see a possible council update in this game every quarter. And if it doesn't come, I would be pleasantly surprised.
For NG, the true measure of a great company is when your customers would be investors in your company if they could. When your customers don't trust a company enough to invest in you, you really should strongly consider some soul searching and make some fundamental changes. It's up to every employee at NG to reflect on which company they would rather be.
@Kaz is probably quite busy upgrading his proverbial armor, preferably the one with gold dodge and gold hazard suit. If that doesn't help, he can just blame his predecessor for a while :-)
Everyone might want to take a second and remember that @Kaz is just the messenger here. I highly doubt it was his decision to do a council update next week. I believe he was not trying to deceive the player base with his earlier proclamation of no council update with this release This decision came from the executive ranks at NG.
Just hypothetically, if a gaming company who whose stock was traded on the public markets, needed to bolster their first quarter financial results, might they consider doing what they knew would increase sales? NG knows that a council update in this game gives them a quick, short-term boost in sales based on their past updates. And they are using it now 30 days before the end of the first quarter, similar to what they have done in part quarters.
Until NG has other games producing revenue, I personally would expect to see a possible council update in this game every quarter. And if it doesn't come, I would be pleasantly surprised.
For NG, the true measure of a great company is when your customers would be investors in your company if they could. When your customers don't trust a company enough to invest in you, you really should strongly consider some soul searching and make some fundamental changes. It's up to every employee at NG to reflect on which company they would rather be.
@Kaz is probably quite busy upgrading his proverbial armor, preferably the one with gold dodge and gold hazard suit. If that doesn't help, he can just blame his predecessor for a while :-)
Speaking only for myself, I don't blame @Kaz as the messenger. Nor have I blamed @Fearofabotplanet or our departed @Teeceezy or even the dev team member who sometimes speaks more bluntly than is good for PR @Shteevie when they had to deliver the message.
It's no fun to deliver such messages.
I've had to deliver shitty messages myself. I worked my ass off to earn an actual insurance license by exhibiting actual knowledge of the entire field of property and casualty insurance (with a score in the 97th percentile) in order to work for a large insurance company that may or may not have a gecko as a mascot just so I could spend my days talking on the phone and listening to people bitch about every little thing and treat me as if I deserved no respect because I was an inanimate voice on the phone and not a real person who not only has the brains to understand insurance regulations but also has to do this thing all day with an average of 60 calls over 8 hours. I have a clear understanding of what it is like to exist in the role of being powerless to change anything but forced to take the heat for whatever policy is decided, or whichever law prevails.
I get that, which is why I sometimes find myself defending mods, or defending NG, because in the world in which we live, sure, they gotta get their money too. They can't make every decision in the best interest of players ahead of things like profit and long-term viability. Fine, sure. It's not that I'm killing the messenger.
It's that the message is shit.
It takes a large ability for suspension of disbelief to imagine that the People in Charge (PIC) didn't know two weeks ago they were going to want a council upgrade. Unless the NG board of directors has suddenly changed hands or management been suddenly replaced, and the new PIC thought it would be wise to go back on the previous official word of the company - this was planned. That makes it a clear bait and switch. It's not just a "we changed our minds." It's outright dishonesty.
And even in the magically unlikely scenario of a suddenly new PIC, somebody knew this was coming. Which means the message they told their people to go out and sell previously was a complete lie, and they knew it.
Kaz may just be the messenger, and he's been a good and seemingly upfront and honest and fair-dealing one so far; but you take the good, you take the bad, the facts of life.
I can barely restrain my anger as a mostly FTP. If I had purchased weapons based on the earlier pronouncement of no council increase, my anger would be entirely unrestrained. It's complete horse shit. Fuck them for being so dastardly to pull such a stunt, and fuck us for being so addicted most of us will probably go along with it despite knowing it's a Montreal Screwjob.
A scorpion and a frog meet on the bank of a stream and the scorpion asks the frog to carry him across on its back. The frog asks, “How do I know you won’t sting me?” The scorpion says, “Because if I do, I will die too.”
The frog is satisfied, and they set out. But in midstream, the scorpion stings the frog. The frog feels the onset of paralysis and starts to sink, knowing they both will drown, but has just enough time to gasp “Why?”
There was most likely a miscommunication between staff.. NG has a lot of stuff going on aside from NML , new staff and trying to balance their efforts between multiple ventures. This is just my opinion, but I think things have been better than they have for a long time and this community is lucky to have Kaz, if the game was dying or they were desperate for funds , they could easily start having crazy events that people buy boosters for for a quick buck , instead we have council updates and real life Jesus and Tara doing new commercials for NML. I think this Carol event is bad timing (in hindsight with the council announcement) but I also think this time they have rolled things out correctly otherwise and will make things right . I hope they don't prove me wrong , but I have faith
Well I once almost quit this game and I am not sure on what to do now. Before this council upgrade announcement I was feeling I was kinda like playing in auto-pilot, mainly for my guild and also for reaching #1 in Portugal (I am around 1k stars away from the guy who leads). This news is upsetting, to say the least.
I do not blame @Kaz at all but I feel lied to. The last council upgrades were never denied beforehand but this one was. The idea that NGs passed was something like "buy all the winter weapons you like because no council upgrade comes with the 2.10 release". Well that was almost true, since no council upgrade came out the day 2.10 did, but come on!!! You only decided on the council upgrade after that???
Sounds like someone deliberately lied to us all and that is just not right or acceptable in any way. I will evaluate my position regarding this game in the next days.
Just like regular life, never enough time to catch up @EL34xyz. LOL Hopefully, a few weeks from now there will be a 5 second upgrade weekend. NG would get plenty of players to purchase a gas booster as well as a 2x booster.
The 5 second this is ok, but nothing to get exited about The amount of XP it takes to upgrade one item or Srvr if so huge at level 23 That is, if I actually have enough XP at that time to do one 5 second upgrade
Totally depends upon your xp situation. I currently have 30+ legendary equipment fully upgraded waiting to be scrapped. With a survivor 5 second upgrade weekend, I would be more than happy to purchase a 2x booster and probably upgrade 10+ toons, That's not even counting the legendary or epic equipment I haven't upgraded.
Pro Tip : don't scrap epic or legendary equipment without the 2x booster!!
The simplest version of the story is that there was a break in communication. At the time the question was asked, Kaz was still learning his responsibilities, and the planning for 2.10 was only just started. We had an unaddressed topic on our planning topics list about whether to do the CL or not, and a lot of other elements of development affected that decision; testing bandwidth, xmas holidays, the apple app requirements that were bing released around the same time, etc.
We had not yet decided to do the CL or not at the time that the answer was given, and therefore the community, support, and testing teams had not yet been informed. As far as Kaz know at the time, he was telling the absolute truth.
We later made the decision to do the CL increase, once we knew we could do it in the timeframe we were dealing with, and found out that the contrary message had already been sent. By then, the "damage had already been done", so to speak. We looked at the number of players that had bought the items, how long there was on the calendar before the CL increase would take effect, and how previous patterns of equipment sales and CL increase announcements had gone. We decided to sell the weapons at a greater discount from then on [meaning that there would be more other items in the bundles], and that we would de-emphasize them in the messaging and promotions in the game. Specifically, if you were a player with an account over a certain age, we would show you different bundles in the popups and feature non-equipment bundles instead.
However, the majority of players that make purchases are not max level. They use the equipment for much longer than one CL increase period. Stopping sales altogether would have a big negative impact on us. The weapons are still top of the line, and finding replacements for them in a short time would require lots of luck. They are, as far as we are concerned, still useful in the game, and therefore players will be able to benefit from having them. Even if you bought it yesterday, a winter weapon is probably your best-in-slot for the next 2-3 months based on the player habits of buying weapons from the cash and TG shops.
The series of events around the announcement was extremely unfortunate. People say that they feel lied to, and they are right to say so. It wasn't our intention to misinform people, and we have taken steps to make sure it doesn't happen again. This involves keeping the community team members more deeply connected to the goings-on in the dev team, and reexamining possible designs for making purchased equipment usable for longer periods.
It was no one person's final say in making the decision to do the CL, or what to sell when, but I am certainly more responsible than anyone else here. While they aren't directly connected, we have been making several decisions about selecting events, rewards, and update features in light of the fact that the CL update was coming, and how we of course don't want to "pile on" any more missteps to what was already a bad situation. Words are less important than actions, and so I hope that players can look at the broader scope of events over the last few months to see the additional effort we have made to being reactive, transparent, and following the wishes of the community wherever possible. This event with the Council Level increase announcement is an outlier, and not the way that we ever intend to operate. If you don't believe me now, I hope to change your mind in the weeks and months to come.
Development Team Member - The Walking Dead: No Man's Land Please note: Development is a fluid process, and suggestions and implementation take time and iteration. Any discussion of future features, deadlines, updates, balance changes, and such should be considered prospective and subject to change.
The simplest version of the story is that there was a break in communication. At the time the question was asked, Kaz was still learning his responsibilities, and the planning for 2.10 was only just started. We had an unaddressed topic on our planning topics list about whether to do the CL or not, and a lot of other elements of development affected that decision; testing bandwidth, xmas holidays, the apple app requirements that were bing released around the same time, etc.
We had not yet decided to do the CL or not at the time that the answer was given, and therefore the community, support, and testing teams had not yet been informed. As far as Kaz know at the time, he was telling the absolute truth.
We later made the decision to do the CL increase, once we knew we could do it in the timeframe we were dealing with, and found out that the contrary message had already been sent. By then, the "damage had already been done", so to speak. We looked at the number of players that had bought the items, how long there was on the calendar before the CL increase would take effect, and how previous patterns of equipment sales and CL increase announcements had gone. We decided to sell the weapons at a greater discount from then on [meaning that there would be more other items in the bundles], and that we would de-emphasize them in the messaging and promotions in the game. Specifically, if you were a player with an account over a certain age, we would show you different bundles in the popups and feature non-equipment bundles instead.
However, the majority of players that make purchases are not max level. They use the equipment for much longer than one CL increase period. Stooping sales altogether would have a big negative impact on us. The weapons are still top of the line, and finding replacements for them in a short time would require lots of luck. They are, as far as we are concerned, still useful in the game, and therefore players will be able to benefit from having them. Even if you bought it yesterday, a winter weapon is probably your best-in-slot for the next 2-3 months based on the player habits of buying weapons from the cash and TG shops.
The series of events around the announcement was extremely unfortunate. People say that they feel lied to, and they are right to say so. It wasn't our intention to misinform people, and we have taken steps to make sure it doesn't happen again. This involves keeping the community team members more deeply connected to the goings-on in the dev team, and reexamining possible designs for making purchased equipment usable for longer periods.
It was no one person's final say in making the decision to do the CL, or what to sell when, but I am certainly more responsible than anyone else here. While they aren't directly connected, we have been making several decisions about selecting events, rewards, and update features in light of the fact that the CL update was coming, and how we of course don't want to "pile on" any more missteps to what was already a bad situation. Words are less important than actions, and so I hope that players can look at the broader scope of events over the last few months to see the additional effort we have made to being reactive, transparent, and following the wishes of the community wherever possible. This event with the Council Level increase announcement is an outlier, and not the way that we ever intend to operate. If you don't believe me now, I hope to change your mind in the weeks and months to come.
Words are less important than actions.... like going back on said words and not offering compensation to those who paid real money based on the information given them by NG. Such bullshit. And saying that the weapons are still relevant and so they aren't deserving of a refund... Wow. You should try putting yourself in someone else's shoes some day. You should refund those who bought the bundles while at survivor level 23, no questions asked.
Kaz has become an amazing asset to the team and for the players. With him in place, many players who felt alienated by NG (and @Shteevie's out-of-touch and, frankly, insulting responses specifically) have started to feel relevant and listened to. The information that the people who make decisions needs to be given to the team to counter something like this happening, and here the onus should be on NG, not on our pocketbooks and the pocketbooks of our fellow players.
Warn/ban me if you like, this is complete shit.
Also, specifically to @Kaz, love you man. I don't think that anyone who read your comment on buying bundles blames you an iota, and loves you for all of your efforts.
So @Kaz, the community manager, was kept in the dark about the council upgrade until he posted the announcement about it yesterday? Go on, @Shteevie, pull the other one.
Comments
Now I have to grab a towel, or a nearby sock, and rub my jeans dry.
Yeah, that's the ticket...
It would seem that all of those refunds would seriously cut into the profits made from the council upgrade.
Personally I did not purchase any weapons, but I reported to the two guilds in my guild family that there was going to be no council upgrade in 2.10 and it feels fucking awful to have passed on the info that they would have at least a while to use those weapons/gear before an upgrade in council, and this is true for many, many other people.
https://forums.nextgames.com/walkingdead/discussion/33251/council-upgrade-and-balancing-changes-in-2-10#latest
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And kind of sucky if you're say level 20 and get a level 24 weapon. Sure, it's waiting for you. but that's a long wait.
I’ll be the first to say, in anticipation of them running this again for a different hero I don’t plan to make any other heroes legendary again unless there’s a benefit for it like the kingdom spear. I was one of those in a sweet spot. Needed 150 tokens. Got them easily. Without spending a dime. I’m fortunate. Others aren’t.
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Freemium... the "mium" is latin for 'not really'
Congrats to you, seriously.
It's a disappointment that I can't get it. But not something I will dwell on too much.
More disappointing is the council level announcement.
I would have taken it in stride if it were announced as part of 3.10.
But to randomly drop it 2 weeks later after explicitly stating there would be no council increase? That's crap.
> So based on the fact you guys lied about the council upgrade and told us it was safe to buy weapons and gear are you going to refund us since there now crap and out dated? You guys really cheated a lot of people. You guys need to make it where weapons can just keep leveling up.
Quoting and bumping in the interest of truth. They lied. They made sales on those lies. In American business that’s called “Bait and Switch.”
Elder of JiltedProphet - 2 MILLION Stars and counting! Always recruiting, get in touch!
You too quickly get maxed out on XP and have to spend a fair amount of gold to push buildings and take advantage.
Now a DOUBLE EVENT with x2 XP AND 5 sec upgrades??? That's ideal. Take my $1.99 every time.
Join ZOMBREX! We have a tiered guild structure so players of every level and ambition can find a home they fit in.
Remember, search ZOMBREX SATISFIES. Check us out HERE
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Analyze This with ALF4reals | v1 | v2 | v3 |
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Just hypothetically, if a gaming company who whose stock was traded on the public markets, needed to bolster their first quarter financial results, might they consider doing what they knew would increase sales? NG knows that a council update in this game gives them a quick, short-term boost in sales based on their past updates. And they are using it now 30 days before the end of the first quarter, similar to what they have done in part quarters.
Until NG has other games producing revenue, I personally would expect to see a possible council update in this game every quarter. And if it doesn't come, I would be pleasantly surprised.
For NG, the true measure of a great company is when your customers would be investors in your company if they could. When your customers don't trust a company enough to invest in you, you really should strongly consider some soul searching and make some fundamental changes. It's up to every employee at NG to reflect on which company they would rather be.
@Kaz is probably quite busy upgrading his proverbial armor, preferably the one with gold dodge and gold hazard suit. If that doesn't help, he can just blame his predecessor for a while :-)
I love your DOUBLE EVENT with x2 XP AND 5 sec upgrades idea! I hope that one goes through!
Nor have I blamed @Fearofabotplanet or our departed @Teeceezy or even the dev team member who sometimes speaks more bluntly than is good for PR @Shteevie when they had to deliver the message.
It's no fun to deliver such messages.
I've had to deliver shitty messages myself. I worked my ass off to earn an actual insurance license by exhibiting actual knowledge of the entire field of property and casualty insurance (with a score in the 97th percentile) in order to work for a large insurance company that may or may not have a gecko as a mascot just so I could spend my days talking on the phone and listening to people bitch about every little thing and treat me as if I deserved no respect because I was an inanimate voice on the phone and not a real person who not only has the brains to understand insurance regulations but also has to do this thing all day with an average of 60 calls over 8 hours. I have a clear understanding of what it is like to exist in the role of being powerless to change anything but forced to take the heat for whatever policy is decided, or whichever law prevails.
I get that, which is why I sometimes find myself defending mods, or defending NG, because in the world in which we live, sure, they gotta get their money too. They can't make every decision in the best interest of players ahead of things like profit and long-term viability. Fine, sure.
It's not that I'm killing the messenger.
It's that the message is shit.
It takes a large ability for suspension of disbelief to imagine that the People in Charge (PIC) didn't know two weeks ago they were going to want a council upgrade. Unless the NG board of directors has suddenly changed hands or management been suddenly replaced, and the new PIC thought it would be wise to go back on the previous official word of the company - this was planned. That makes it a clear bait and switch. It's not just a "we changed our minds." It's outright dishonesty.
And even in the magically unlikely scenario of a suddenly new PIC, somebody knew this was coming. Which means the message they told their people to go out and sell previously was a complete lie, and they knew it.
Kaz may just be the messenger, and he's been a good and seemingly upfront and honest and fair-dealing one so far; but you take the good, you take the bad, the facts of life.
I can barely restrain my anger as a mostly FTP. If I had purchased weapons based on the earlier pronouncement of no council increase, my anger would be entirely unrestrained. It's complete horse shit. Fuck them for being so dastardly to pull such a stunt, and fuck us for being so addicted most of us will probably go along with it despite knowing it's a Montreal Screwjob.
The frog is satisfied, and they set out. But in midstream, the scorpion stings the frog. The frog feels the onset of paralysis and starts to sink, knowing they both will drown, but has just enough time to gasp “Why?”
Replies the scorpion: “It’s my nature…”
I do not blame @Kaz at all but I feel lied to. The last council upgrades were never denied beforehand but this one was. The idea that NGs passed was something like "buy all the winter weapons you like because no council upgrade comes with the 2.10 release". Well that was almost true, since no council upgrade came out the day 2.10 did, but come on!!! You only decided on the council upgrade after that???
Sounds like someone deliberately lied to us all and that is just not right or acceptable in any way. I will evaluate my position regarding this game in the next days.
Pro Tip : don't scrap epic or legendary equipment without the 2x booster!!
You need the carrot in front of the horse to keep it motivated, right?
Proud elder of Dead Stalkers
We had not yet decided to do the CL or not at the time that the answer was given, and therefore the community, support, and testing teams had not yet been informed. As far as Kaz know at the time, he was telling the absolute truth.
We later made the decision to do the CL increase, once we knew we could do it in the timeframe we were dealing with, and found out that the contrary message had already been sent. By then, the "damage had already been done", so to speak. We looked at the number of players that had bought the items, how long there was on the calendar before the CL increase would take effect, and how previous patterns of equipment sales and CL increase announcements had gone. We decided to sell the weapons at a greater discount from then on [meaning that there would be more other items in the bundles], and that we would de-emphasize them in the messaging and promotions in the game. Specifically, if you were a player with an account over a certain age, we would show you different bundles in the popups and feature non-equipment bundles instead.
However, the majority of players that make purchases are not max level. They use the equipment for much longer than one CL increase period. Stopping sales altogether would have a big negative impact on us. The weapons are still top of the line, and finding replacements for them in a short time would require lots of luck. They are, as far as we are concerned, still useful in the game, and therefore players will be able to benefit from having them. Even if you bought it yesterday, a winter weapon is probably your best-in-slot for the next 2-3 months based on the player habits of buying weapons from the cash and TG shops.
The series of events around the announcement was extremely unfortunate. People say that they feel lied to, and they are right to say so. It wasn't our intention to misinform people, and we have taken steps to make sure it doesn't happen again. This involves keeping the community team members more deeply connected to the goings-on in the dev team, and reexamining possible designs for making purchased equipment usable for longer periods.
It was no one person's final say in making the decision to do the CL, or what to sell when, but I am certainly more responsible than anyone else here. While they aren't directly connected, we have been making several decisions about selecting events, rewards, and update features in light of the fact that the CL update was coming, and how we of course don't want to "pile on" any more missteps to what was already a bad situation. Words are less important than actions, and so I hope that players can look at the broader scope of events over the last few months to see the additional effort we have made to being reactive, transparent, and following the wishes of the community wherever possible. This event with the Council Level increase announcement is an outlier, and not the way that we ever intend to operate. If you don't believe me now, I hope to change your mind in the weeks and months to come.
Please note: Development is a fluid process, and suggestions and implementation take time and iteration. Any discussion of future features, deadlines, updates, balance changes, and such should be considered prospective and subject to change.
Kaz has become an amazing asset to the team and for the players. With him in place, many players who felt alienated by NG (and @Shteevie's out-of-touch and, frankly, insulting responses specifically) have started to feel relevant and listened to. The information that the people who make decisions needs to be given to the team to counter something like this happening, and here the onus should be on NG, not on our pocketbooks and the pocketbooks of our fellow players.
Warn/ban me if you like, this is complete shit.
Also, specifically to @Kaz, love you man. I don't think that anyone who read your comment on buying bundles blames you an iota, and loves you for all of your efforts.