Time to Adjust Reroll Economics since Weakening and Perseverance are "Must Have" and NOT Incremental

Previously, traits are important but they are never "required". For example, if you don't have ruthless or power strike, yeah, it takes longer to kill enemies, but you can kill them regardless.

Before weakening and perseverance, all traits are "incremental" - that is, they increase certain things by some percentage. The only important trait that is not incremental used to be only the "Critical Aim" trait, however, the percentage of this trait is small enough that it is not game-changing = i.e., not "required".

Perseverance and weakening are different - if you don't have either (sometimes you might even need both), it usually means you will not be able to complete certain maps given certain star heroes. Frankly, this is a huge turn off not only for F2P people but also people who did and will pay "within reasons".

Some ideas to fix this trait reroll system:

1. Decreasing cost of reroll for each reroll not taken or reroll token refund (say, 50% like hero token) for each reroll not taken when melee survivor is not presented with perseverance and/or weakening and not yet have both traits (therefore, allowing cheaper cost to obtain these 2 new traits - while leaving existing mechanics and economics the same for all other traits)

2. Fix price for these 2 traits - either bundles or gold or reroll tokens

I want to emphasize again that while I see no problem with rerolling mechanics until now -- unlike all other classical traits, both perseverance and weakening are very different. Subjecting them to such slot machine economics is very demotivating.


  • ZXerZXer Member Posts: 176
    I would also like to add a 3rd idea to fix:

    3. Give all melee survivors a baseline of 30% chance to get 1 charge point, then adjust the trait tables for both perseverance and weakening (subtract each trait by 15%). So you give every melee survivor a chance to get charge point without kill - and these odds will go up as you have the proper trait and going up on trait levels - making these 2 traits to be as incremental as the classical traits such as ruthless and power strike.
  • FirekidFirekid Member Posts: 3,176
    I think NG have tried to address your 3rd point with weakening itself. As if you attack a walker that is weak then melee gain a charge point (with 34%) luck even if they don’t have perseverance or weakening. 
    However I agree that the reroll lottery should be reworked but for all traits not just those two. 
  • ZXerZXer Member Posts: 176
    @Firekid I mean you could still spend 5-6-7 or maybe a dozen rerolls and still get neither perseverance nor weakening. You assume you can still go in with one hero without either trait and one hero with weakening - which is assuming you’ve spent 6-7 rerolls and actually got ONE hero with weakening, which may not be the case because even after 12 rerolls you still so t get one. Never mind in nightmare many cases you’re gonna have to use princess and Yumiko anyway - and no weakening traits on them.

    On reworking the reroll of course if extended to all traits it will be even better. However I mean - technically not having power strike or ruthless or strong will not disqualify you from completing a challenge with star hero. Not having neither perseverance nor weakening on your bruiser star hero - that will pretty much will disqualify anyone - even the best players with well spent account.

    So I mean yeah, of course game developers need to raise revenue too, and reroll tokens are one way of raising revenue. So if they think that existing revenue model is good enough - so be it. I just think if they want to use the same model for these 2 new traits - it will backfire. 
  • FirekidFirekid Member Posts: 3,176
    Not against it at all, just can’t see them messing with the reroll mechanic for 2 traits in particular. Great if they do though as I wasted 250 reroll tokens trying to get weakening into T-Dog 
  • NoiseratingNoiserating Member Posts: 149
    At least they could suppress some useless trait such "Defensive stance".
  • ZXerZXer Member Posts: 176
    @Lexia @Fluxxx this idea of having "Reroll token +" in season pass sounds very reasonable? Would definitely add to popularity of season pass.
  • FuriousMoldovanFuriousMoldovan Member Posts: 2,106
    This topic has been raised one too many times, especially for rerolling badge bonuses. No resolve in sight yet.
    Leader of the original TWD guild family (est. 10/2015). We Are TWD 😎
    FuriousMoldovan's NML Glossary & Guild Wars Difficulty Guide
  • FuriousMoldovanFuriousMoldovan Member Posts: 2,106
    What you're looking for is not exclusion for Weakening & Psv but rework of survivor trait rerolling as a whole:

    "I'm suggesting to improve rerolling mechanics a bit: instead of excluding only 2 cancelled traits for the next round, make rerolling cycle through ALL possible traits (on canceling) before offering previously cancelled options again."

    Leader of the original TWD guild family (est. 10/2015). We Are TWD 😎
    FuriousMoldovan's NML Glossary & Guild Wars Difficulty Guide
  • ZXerZXer Member Posts: 176
    @FuriousMoldovanof course what you’re saying is even better. I’m just trying to argue some kind of middle way where rerolling will be neither too easy nor too difficult that it’s become off-putting
  • GothgulGothgul Member Posts: 292
    Not to mention how quickly we moved on from Psv being the "must have" trait to Weakening. How many reroll and hero tokens down the drain, which is mega expensive with 3 or 4+ pink heros. I agree they are both great and melee needs love, but introduced like this in quick succession, just looks like a cash grab and will just turn people off if that is the new trend.
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