Why high level players are quitting the game

Over the past several months, my guild (top 25 in the u.s.) has lost several of its best, most devoted, most active, highest level (and probably highest spending) players. The reasons boil down to only a few and are easily correctable:

1. Two challenges a week - Challenges are time consuming and are a total grind. In order to max out stars, you have to get on very frequently and have little time to work on gathering resources for upgrades. Some have stopped playing because it does not leave them enough time for their real lives.

1a. The early levels of the challenges are way too easy - they are literally not a "challenge" at all. They are just a time suck.

1b. The rewards for early level challenges are not helpful - to give people 180xp when they are saving for a 2.3 million upgrade or to give them a level 1 rifle when their survivors are level 16 (that they can then scrap for 100xp) are also not helpful.

I believe the fix is simple.....going back to one challenge a week is an option that has been discussed over and over. It's still an option....but doesn't sound like one that you guys want to entertain....that's fine.....I think you could even go to three challenges a week IF you level set the challenge starting level based on the players level of survivors. my guys are level 16 and 17.....I don't even take any damage to my guys until I have cycled through the entire challenge 7 or 8 times. Just START me in the challenge as if I had already cycled through 6 times. Start a lower level player as if they had only cycled through 3 times etc.

I really think this solves all your problems:

- the challenges become challenging
- the rewards match your experience level
- you can finish the challenges much faster because they become more difficult more quickly
- and as an added bonus for YOU....survivors will spend more time in the hospital and players will spend more gold to heal them

Think about it.....seriously.....I'm tired of our best players quitting.....but as I get higher and higher level, I totally get where they are coming from
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  • kryptonixkryptonix Member Posts: 253
    I appreciate any light brought to this subject so that we (the community and the developers) can work on an answer for the End Game.

    We understand that 99% of the players have not reached this point yet, but the key word is yet, you will get to the end, and realize the problem that we see now.
  • KaLiKaLi Member Posts: 426
    Yeah i think all us high level players are feeling the same and it will take a great update to save us all or it could be time for us to move on
  • tammytammy Member Posts: 1,716
    Completely agree @Sleestak the first few levels of the challenges are a total waste of time for higher level players :(

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  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 2,344
    I completely hate the 2 challenge system and anyone that has known me for more than five minutes is fully aware of that. One of the only few times that I'm talking about my experiences with this game during off-game chat where I actually swear is while expressing my feelings about the 2 challenges per week thing here. I have not given much thought to the rest of what you are saying about the challenge system other than 2 are too much @Sleestak but do completely agree that trying to stay competitive while Next Games pushes their back to back challenge stance has indeed pushed a lot of good players and great people away from this game and that sucks.
    SlickRick[Deleted User]Annette578blkjack0o
  • SleestakSleestak Member Posts: 38
    Like I said, 2 or even 3 challenges a week would be fine if they took 1/5th of the time and effort.

    Which is why I think tailoring the starting point to the level of player makes sense. You could be done with each challenge in a short amount of time if, no matter WHAT level of player you are, you would find it very difficult to do more than 3 cycles.

    As it stands right now....you are actually PUNISHING players for improving. Someone with level 5 survivors is done and maxed out on the challenge very quickly. They end up spending 30-45 minutes playing before they can't go any further. Someone with level 14, 15, 16+ survivors has to spend hours.

    After players realize this....and do it challenge after challenge after challenge....they eventually say, "I'm done....not worth it" my guild has lost probably a dozen or so players who were at level 40+ since we went to the two challenges a week.
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 2,344

    The issue with tailoring each challenge to player level is that different players have different styles. I'm a level 49 and have 24 survivor slots which are leveled between 15-17. I just spoke on the phone with another player that is a level 40 and has about 16 player slots and survivors leveled up 17 also. What formula would you use to determine which level the challenge should start on for both us and how do you factor gear both locked and unlocked into it so that its balanced in a way that doesn't punish some players and unfairly reward others?


    I realize at this point that Next Games not only does not agree with me about this but that they also don't care about how I feel about it as well but that does not stop me from stating how I feel about it every time it is brought up. So no I don't think another poll would help but if someone puts another up I'll state the same thing over again in that post as well.
    Annette578[Deleted User][Deleted User]
  • PutchucoPutchuco Member Posts: 1,289
    Totally agree, it's just a matter of time before the grind will get to you.
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  • lmfgunnutlmfgunnut Member Posts: 1,636
    It has to be based on survivor level, much like the exploration levels. Player level allows too much variability. Maybe you let each player choose it as an option. Choose map, choose starting level. If you make it through with 3 stars you get awarded Round # X 3 in stars. Since I can make it through the 13th round, sometimes without injury, I might choose to start there. If I finish it I'm awarded 39 stars.

    Problem with that model is that I have not spent the 70 gas to get there...meaning that NG has missed out on the opportunity to sell me the gas. Perhaps each round that you play like that could cost the right amount of gas. For instance, I have 23 gas I can store. If i approach a mission at the 13th round with a full tank, they take all 23 of my gas and charge me 94 gold to make up for the balance. Not everyone will want to do that, but for those not seeking to spend gold, they could start at the 6th round which would cost 23 gas. Wait for a refill, come back and do the next mission.
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  • theblueboxthebluebox Member Posts: 807
    The only drawback I see to your assessment is that you will be shorting yourself a serious number of stars if you start at a higher level.

    Each round has a max of 18 stars. If you were to start at level 12 challenges, that is 126 stars you potentially will not get. (Levels 3, 5, 7, 8, 9, 10, and 11 is 7x18=126). If a top ranking guild has 20 active end game members, that is 2,520 stars that guild will not get. NG will not award those stars unless you go through the easy challenges and attain them. By shorting your guild those stars, you guild will not rank as the highest anymore. Guilds with midlevel and new players will pass you because they would be grinding through the lower levels. I am pretty sure you wouldn't like that.

    Perhaps a better solution would be for their to be an auto battle option on the lower challenges. Let's say a player has reached level 45. On the challenges up to level 12, that player would get an auto battle button after selecting their team. The system automatically calculates the battle results without actually manually running the battle. The entire 6 missions could be completed within three minutes. That would free the player to go do other things for the 57 minutes the challenge cools down. You get the stars and don't short yourself.
  • ReeconnReeconn Member Posts: 540
    But NOT every one is a high level player , the low level players like the 2 challenges a week so they can farm supplies and XP. I am level 48 player , i have completed all missions on all difficulties so all i can play is outpost and the 2 challenges. A lot of people on here have spent a lot of money to "buy" themselves to the top and now feel frustrated waiting for eveyone else to catch up
  • LadyAquilaLadyAquila Member Posts: 625
    jester said:

    Let us use two survivors on early levels for 4 stars.

    LOVE that idea! That would increase the complexity for higher level players without ruining anything for lower level ones, and players that are going to spend would still do so.
  • jesterjester Member Posts: 2,753
    I'd love to see how far I could push it with only two.
  • LadyAquilaLadyAquila Member Posts: 625
    Some of the Factory missions would be tough with two players. If nothing else it might be fun to see your high levels battle through a swarm of level 3s.
  • SleestakSleestak Member Posts: 38
    I don't really like to compare games because they are so different......but.......(apparently that won't stop me) I think it should work similarly to the way clan wars are in clash of clans. Yes.....you would lose out on a lot of stars by starting 6 cycles through.....but then the challenge won't become getting 5x as many stars as someone else....but maximizing the fewer stars you CAN get.

    So maybe an average player with level 8 survivors can get, whatever, 50 stars. But a player who is more skillful could get 60 stars with level 8 survivors

    So you set a similar benchmark for all levels. If average player can get 50 stars, then a player with level 19 survivors should be starting high enough that an average level 19 player can get 50 stars and a more skillful player gets 60.

    I really love this setup because it means that all players can contribute equally to the guild during challenges regardless of level. And it also means that really pushing yourself to get 3 or 4 or 7 extra stars is meaningful. And LISTEN UP developers....means that maybe players will spend for gas or hospital healing or to bump up a weapon just to get those few, meaningful stars.
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 2,344

    Yeah if it was optional maybe that can work out that way but again I would just like Next Games to go back to what we had before rather than to roll the dice by asking them to introduce something new which can lead to more game bugs and possible exploits being discovered and abused.
    PapaSmurfAnnette578[Deleted User]
  • capibaracapibara Member Posts: 6,819
    I totally agree with you @Sleestak ..but consider also that nothing last forever... Maybe many high level players needed to letting go...
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  • SleestakSleestak Member Posts: 38
    One other note: I know nextgames will be getting paid based on number of commercial views.....I do not watch commercials for extra crates during the first 6 or 7 cycles of a challenge as it isn't worth it to get an extra 200 tomatoes or a level 3 dagger. More challenging challenges with rewards that are equal to your level would result in more commercial clicks.

    @Teeceezy, I don't know if you are following this discussion but you should.....I am not only suggesting something that would benefit layers but make you more money. You're welcome.
  • SleestakSleestak Member Posts: 38
    Layers = players
  • thatdamngoodcire777thatdamngoodcire777 Member Posts: 85
    Sleestak, your making valid points for us and the developers. I do challenge missions but as soon as I see that "watch video" button, I do a high level exploration mission. Level 3 gear and rewards vs level 18...choices, choices. But now my guild suffers because I shy away from challenges. I don't want to spend my gas on just low level challenges and then ANOTHER challenge pops up. I just had someone quit as well because of this.
  • AmigaAmiga Member Posts: 3,770
    When I have to srart every 3 days again challenge from boring low lvl then I'm sick...
    Couldn't agree more with you..
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  • tembeltembel Member Posts: 132
    this topic has to pinned up in "general no man's land discussion" section like announcements or some known bug reports.

    can u do it @Alibaba @zbot @C_Lloyd ?

    and totally agree with you @Sleestak . even if most of u said was already discussed under another topics, yours are definetly gathering them together.

    one last idea about skipping early challenge missons :
    players can be rewarded 3 challenge stars for each challenge mission which are 2 level below their max survivor levels.
    so nobody looses nothing even low level players.

    for ex : i have 18 level survivors and i have to be rewarded 3 stars for each challenge mission until recommended 16's starting.

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  • theRealBendertheRealBender Member Posts: 1,251
    This topic isn't really what the title says. It's really about Challenges. The OP has inferred that Challenges are the only or main reason top players leave. I personally would not leave if Challenges were never improved but the rest of the game was improved.

    IMO Challenges have a lot of room for improvement but there are other things that MUST improve for longevity. When it comes to top players that means several things already brought up in many other threads and support tickets.
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  • Phoenix527Phoenix527 Member Posts: 144
    Eliminate cool down times for the missions. There's already enough wait time for gas (which people spend gold on) so why not just eliminate the cool down. That way us higher level players can blow through the early crap quickly.

    And also have the rewards match player level. Or even minus 2 until we get to the correct recommended survivor level. 500xp a mission does nothing when we get more than Tay from camp walkers and we need over 2 million to upgrade.
  • TUCOTUCO Member Posts: 183
    Throw in a toggle switch in settings to lockout deadly missions. Then I can cut my 5yr old loose on the lower level missions that are to much of a grind for me. He would have fun until I have to take over. Win Win.
  • DeathwishDeathwish Member Posts: 38
    I absolutely HATE the 2 challenges. I've said this many times. It is a huge time waster. I'm sitting here wasting time grinding through low levels with crap rewards while sacrificing doing the story mission/resources. I think the devs thought people would start spending money to reset gas prices in order to get more stars. It is all about the $$$$ in the end.

    My clan has upped the minimum to 100 stars a challenge. That means 200 stars a week. I was getting tired of the grind with one challenge a week. With two, it is getting old and boring really fast. Like others have said, I don't want this game to become my part-time job where it is a snorefest to grind out stars. I know it isn't the game's fault for my clan upping the star limit but they want to compete for rank and I like the crew I play with. It would suck to have to be replaced or quit this game because the game is becoming too demanding/time consuming and feeling like a part-time job.
  • SleestakSleestak Member Posts: 38
    Not to be argumentative...but the topic is exactly what the topic says.

    I'm not saying that challenges are the ONLY reason that higher level players are leaving the game. But in my experience, every single person leaving my guild has stated that the game is just not fun anymore...and specifically because of having to spend every available moment grinding out stars just for the sake of grinding out stars.

    I simply offered some ideas that I thought would alleviate the problem....keep the game fun....keep people interested....and at the same time, perhaps make the developers some cash...because as has been said over and over again....that is their driving force.

    Sorry if you think this is all old news and off topic....I disagree
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