I had better luck with Maggie tokens in the 15 radio calls shown above At least I am getting minimum 32 tokens per call while searching for new srvrs which I need to do anyway
The token cost is not as good overall by collecting tokens via radio calls If you break it all down into tg cost per token, it looks like this
1 radio = 600 tg's in the store So a 15 radio call cost = 9000 tg's ---------------------------------------
Token cost by a 15 Radio call 32 tokens for a rare srvr: 9000 / 32 = 281 tg's per token 128 tokens for an epic srvr: 9000 / 128 = 70 tg's per token 256 tokens for a legendary srvr: 9000 / 256 = 35 tg's per token That's only if you decide to cash in the srvrs for tokens
So the trade store is your best bet if all you want is tokens Unless you score an Epic or a Legendary srvr on a radio call and decide to cash them in for tokens
But, you do get radios for free while playing, so radio calls for tokens works out for free if you do not buy radios
Maggie Glenn Jesus Abraham Rick Daryl Michonne Carol.
@Shteevie@Teeceezy Any chance the powers that be at NG can be convinced that the trade shop needs to have the 3 and 5 radio boxes for purchase come come up more often during the hero week event. Is there anything bigger than the 5 radio box in the TG shop? I thought I saw one after the update that was more than 5 but I forgot already!
The removal of 2 & 8 token drops from 15x calls is permanent, yes.
Thank you very much! This is wonderful news to hear! While the Hero Calls are still poor value, the alternative 15 radio call is very much improved by eliminating the 2 and 8 token results. I am very happy about this change.
Same here. The 'special' call is still poor value. But the 15 radio call has been much improved, by removing the 2 and 8 token results. I am looking forward to future phone events where I can take advantage of this (just not events that try to force me to use a low quality 10 phone call).
@Amiga The ironicness of it all is 4 maggie tokens can be purchased for 800 TG's in the shop when it's offerred costing roughly 1600 TG's. 10 phones cost 6,000 TG's when valued at 600 each phone.
I enjoy buying phones from the TG shop and am thankful they are offerred, but if I'm only gonna get 8 it kinda seems self defeating. I'm just being cynical here, and I'm happy you were even able to get any maggie tokens using the radio call with an increased chance of getting maggie tokens.
But I think i'll save my radio's for 15 radio calls since if I happen to pull an epic that's 128 tokens and 15 radio's are equal to 9,000 TG's it's at least 70 TG's per token.
I know it's been stated all over the forum etc regarding these special events for hero's and shteevie has mentioned they take into effect the data from the previous ones and make tweaks etc, but I look at it this way when it comes to buying these hero radio pulls. I have a chance to get the following using 10 radios -
Comparing 10 radio's to the cost of TG's (6,000 TG's for 10 radio's) and Hero tokens cost 800 TG's for 4 (200 TG's each)
0 Maggie Tokens for 10 radio's = 8 tokens of something else for 6,000 TG's = 750 TG's a token 8 Maggie Tokens for 10 radio's = 8 tokens for Maggie for 6,000 TG's = 750 TG's a token 32 Maggie Tokens for 10 radio's = 32 tokens for Maggie for 6,000 TG's = 187.5 TG's a token 128 Maggie Tokens for 10 radio's = 128 tokens for Maggie for 6,000 TG's = 46.88 TG's a token 256 Maggie Tokens for 10 radio's = 256 tokens for Maggie for 6,000 TG's = 23.43 TG's a token
If you waited TG rotation 8 times to get the hero you want you'd spend 6400 TG's buying "Maggie" tokens. Yes I understand it's not always guaranteed you'd get that hero (or any hero for that matter) but the point I'm trying to say and I hope @Shteevie takes note here. You have 6 possible outcomes when it comes to paying 10 radio's for a specific hero. 2 of them are more costlier than the TG shop rate (0,8). One is slightly better than the TG shop rate (32). 2 are much better but since NG doesn't tell anyone the odds, I feel, it's not worth the gamble since we haven't a clue of the odds.
I've used this analogy before but if I buy a scratchoff I can view the New York Lottery website and find the odds of receiving a winner overall, and the odds of receiving a winner at each individual reward ($1 purchase, odds of $1 winner, $5 winner, $10 winner, $20 winner, $100 winner, $500 winner etc.)
Now this isn't something you can collect with data but maybe use some type of comparison for. We are used to 1 radio calls giving minimum of 2 with 1 choice. We are used to 5 radio calls giving minimum of 8 with 2 choices. We are used to 15 radio calls giving minimum of 32 with 3 chioces.
We are used to 10 radio calls giving minimum of 0 with 2 choices. And I would assume NG is used to hearing us complain about not getting proper pulls etc.
If the hero calls were in line with what we're used to maybe it would be more successful. use 5 radio (instead of 10) giving a minimum of 8 (instead of 0) with 2 choices. Getting 0 or 8 tokens when spending 10 radios is a huge dissapointment. Getting 32 tokens makes us feel excited (because we expect 32 tokens to drop from 15 radio pulls) but the cost of TG's compared to radio's and tokens it's not that big a deal. We're after the 128 and the 256 and I don't expect everyone to pull those everytime.
*edit - realized it's impossible to get 2 Maggie Tokens from the hero event radio call... still possible to get 0 though lol
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I've said it before, but not all game items and currencies are fungible for consistent exchange rates. Ranking different game items against a single unit of currency is folly - you give yourself false conclusions that way. Opportunity cost, random chance, immediate usefulness, depreciation, life expectancy, and other externalities come into play and have a very large impact on the value of an item in the moment. Since you can't buy TG for phones anyways, the conversion rates described are not even possible. Sure, different rates of different resources have different chance to net different results, but the time, effort, and therefore value of gathering those resources is fundamentally different.
Further, you are not taking into account the point of the hero week itself - the chance to get a given hero is significantly increased. You can spend an equal number of phones making 10- and 15-phone calls, and you are on odds to end up with significantly more tokens of the specified hero using the 10-phone calls. We see a wide variety of results from around the forums about the things players get with their pulls, and you can take them all into account. You don't need to believe me for it to be true that the special calls are both better than the previous set, and better for getting the specified hero than even a 15-phone call is. This system is built to allow players to unlock and upgrade heroes slowly, so that each step of increase is appreciated, and the characters can each have a turn being special in the calls and also in the roster. If we just handed out 128-token results 50% of the time, people would still complain.
It's up to you how you use your phones. Or don't use them, if you are waiting for a rainy day. If you don't care who you get, make the 15s.
Development Team Member - The Walking Dead: No Man's Land Please note: Development is a fluid process, and suggestions and implementation take time and iteration. Any discussion of future features, deadlines, updates, balance changes, and such should be considered prospective and subject to change.
Why is it such a big secret to tell the player the percentage amount of the increase? Don't know if we then get a clue if it is a good deal or not. But for myself I get the sense of being handled like a dumbly child by telling me only that there is "a better chance of tokens".
@gespuer Our company policy fits the industry standard of keeping our algorithms and databases to ourselves. It allows us more flexibility to fix bugs, alter events for later use, and to stay flexible when planning for future content. Besides, a player who is unwilling to trust us in the statement of "better chance for tokens" isn't going to be swayed by a table of numbers.
Development Team Member - The Walking Dead: No Man's Land Please note: Development is a fluid process, and suggestions and implementation take time and iteration. Any discussion of future features, deadlines, updates, balance changes, and such should be considered prospective and subject to change.
@gespuer Our company policy fits the industry standard of keeping our algorithms and databases to ourselves. It allows us more flexibility to fix bugs, alter events for later use, and to stay flexible when planning for future content. Besides, a player who is unwilling to trust us in the statement of "better chance for tokens" isn't going to be swayed by a table of numbers.
I think the frustration here is that no one is asking for algorithms, but simply the percentage increase in getting a given hero through these events. Many games do this. Next Games even does this.... This weekend is Warrior weekend! Warrior damage is increased by 50%! You don't say Warrior damage is better this weekend!
And it's not necessarily that players aren't willing to trust you, it's just that 'better chance' could mean a 5% better chance or it could be a 50% better chance, Either way the statement is true, but only one of those percentage increases is worth my time... the other isn't. Disclosing the increased percentage chance would absolutely sway players one way or the other.
Everyone’s got two wolves inside them. One is anger, envy, pride. The other…truth, kindness. Every day they tear each other apart. But it’s not the better wolf that wins. It’s the one you feed.
During the last hero event, our radio collection data had hero tokens dropping at 30% in the special call (we didn't have enough data from each specific hero day to find the increased drop rate for each specific hero.) From 65 regular 5x radio calls, hero tokens dropped at about 10% rate. 15x radio calls dropped hero tokens at 12.7%, so we definitely saw an increase in hero drop frequency from our smaller sample.
@Bill_ZRT It's different when one is related to an item that is directly for sale [phones]. We know from experience that divulging these numbers doesn't help the success of the event.
Additionally, it's quite a bit more complicated than a simple percentage increase, and trying to boil it down to averages might be seen as misleading. There is more than one die roll when you make a radio call.
Development Team Member - The Walking Dead: No Man's Land Please note: Development is a fluid process, and suggestions and implementation take time and iteration. Any discussion of future features, deadlines, updates, balance changes, and such should be considered prospective and subject to change.
@Shteevie even if it's the industry standard, it may not be the best way.
I firmly believe in transparency as the best way, both when it comes to a video game and with other matters in life.
It wouldn't remove conspiracy theories here on the forum but it would reduce them.
That said, it's always better to have events that are immidiately visible. F. ex I always thought the ICELS event had a huge weakness because many people never felt they never got anything (if they had bad RNG luck). A better option would have been to cut the price to 10 radios from 15 and keep the odds unchanged. Then people could see what they get.
40 radio calls (out of a stock of 100) using the special maggie call and I get 2 X 8 maggie tokens. Honestly what is the point of spending so much time trying to get radios when even the increased change of hero tokens hardly makes a dent.
@Bill_ZRT It's different when one is related to an item that is directly for sale [phones]. We know from experience that divulging these numbers doesn't help the success of the event.
We might have to agree to disagree here. If the perceived value of the numbers you disclose are too low, then you're absolutely right that it won't help the success of the event. However, if the perceived value of the numbers you disclose is high, then it absolutely will increase the success of the event. This is the goal of every marketing campaign - to present a perceived value that causes an increase in sales (in this case, participation).
As for your second point - there must be some way to represent the increase in both an accurate and transparent way that will make sense to your players. Without knowing your algorithms (which I'm still not asking for!) I can't make a suggestion here, but there must be a way. Even if it's to disclose just one of the 'numbers'. For example, perhaps you could disclose how much more likely is it that I get a specific hero during this event but leave the number of tokens I may or may not get out of the announcement.
Everyone’s got two wolves inside them. One is anger, envy, pride. The other…truth, kindness. Every day they tear each other apart. But it’s not the better wolf that wins. It’s the one you feed.
I don't understand why buying in larger quantities in the trade store, the token cost goes up? Where does that math ever work out in the real world when buying in larger quantities and bulk?
1 radio = 600 tg's in the store So a 15 radio call cost = 9000 tg's --------------------------------------- Token cost by a 15 Radio call 32 tokens for a rare srvr: 9000 / 32 = 281 tg's per token 128 tokens for an epic srvr: 9000 / 128 = 70 tg's per token 256 tokens for a legendary srvr: 9000 / 256 = 35 tg's per token That's only if you decide to cash in the srvrs for tokens ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Token costs in the trade store 8 tokens cost: 600 / 8 = 75 tg's cost per token 30 tokens cost: 2500 / 30 = 83 tg's cost per token
40 radio calls (out of a stock of 100) using the special maggie call and I get 2 X 8 maggie tokens. Honestly what is the point of spending so much time trying to get radios when even the increased change of hero tokens hardly makes a dent.
You did better than I. Stupidly, I tried 4 Maggie calls (40 radios) and got no Maggie tokens at all. Nothing. I would have been better off doing 8 5-radio calls, or 2+ 15-radio calls, in terms of the tokens I collected.
I've learned my lesson: stay away from these 10-radio call events.
That being said, I am very happy that the 15-radio calls have been adjusted to remove 1* and 2* hero results. Thank you, NG!
On screen you picked x15 call option. Did you use x10 to get Maggie tokens?
@Amiga Yep. Did about 4-5 10x calls and was offered 8 Glenn tokens once, 8 Abraham tokens once and rest times got 2 uncommons. After that did couple 15x calls and first call gave me 128 Michonne tokens, couple epics and what you see in that screenshot, I actually even tried again later. Did 2 10x calls no heroes.
Luck is not on my side it seems. I'm going to stay on 15x calls from now on.
I didnt get more maggie, but i got 32 glenn off a 15 radio pull (boosted both traits on my 2 star)
I was going to call it a win and i accidentally hit another 15 radio pull instead of the x .... and had a come to jesus moment... Boosted the first trait too
Comments
I had a brain freeze
There Are However.. Plenty of Stupid Answers!!
Rhonda
At least I am getting minimum 32 tokens per call while searching for new srvrs which I need to do anyway
The token cost is not as good overall by collecting tokens via radio calls
If you break it all down into tg cost per token, it looks like this
1 radio = 600 tg's in the store
So a 15 radio call cost = 9000 tg's
---------------------------------------
Token cost by a 15 Radio call
32 tokens for a rare srvr: 9000 / 32 = 281 tg's per token
128 tokens for an epic srvr: 9000 / 128 = 70 tg's per token
256 tokens for a legendary srvr: 9000 / 256 = 35 tg's per token
That's only if you decide to cash in the srvrs for tokens
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Token costs in the trade store
8 tokens cost: 600 / 8 = 75 tg's cost per token
30 tokens cost: 2500 / 30 = 83 tg's cost per token
---------------------------------------------------------------------
So the trade store is your best bet if all you want is tokens
Unless you score an Epic or a Legendary srvr on a radio call and decide to cash them in for tokens
But, you do get radios for free while playing, so radio calls for tokens works out for free if you do not buy radios
@Shteevie @Teeceezy Any chance the powers that be at NG can be convinced that the trade shop needs to have the 3 and 5 radio boxes for purchase come come up more often during the hero week event.
Is there anything bigger than the 5 radio box in the TG shop? I thought I saw one after the update that was more than 5 but I forgot already!
First time I have seen her also
But I cashed her in for tokens
Links to threads that are useful for beginners (and in some cases even for veterans)
32-abraham tokens
128-carol tokens
8-maggie tokens
8-jesus tokens
128-maggie tokens
8-jesus tokens
Thank NG!!!!!!!!!
I enjoy buying phones from the TG shop and am thankful they are offerred, but if I'm only gonna get 8 it kinda seems self defeating. I'm just being cynical here, and I'm happy you were even able to get any maggie tokens using the radio call with an increased chance of getting maggie tokens.
But I think i'll save my radio's for 15 radio calls since if I happen to pull an epic that's 128 tokens and 15 radio's are equal to 9,000 TG's it's at least 70 TG's per token.
I know it's been stated all over the forum etc regarding these special events for hero's and shteevie has mentioned they take into effect the data from the previous ones and make tweaks etc, but I look at it this way when it comes to buying these hero radio pulls. I have a chance to get the following using 10 radios -
Comparing 10 radio's to the cost of TG's (6,000 TG's for 10 radio's) and
Hero tokens cost 800 TG's for 4 (200 TG's each)
0 Maggie Tokens for 10 radio's = 8 tokens of something else for 6,000 TG's = 750 TG's a token
8 Maggie Tokens for 10 radio's = 8 tokens for Maggie for 6,000 TG's = 750 TG's a token
32 Maggie Tokens for 10 radio's = 32 tokens for Maggie for 6,000 TG's = 187.5 TG's a token
128 Maggie Tokens for 10 radio's = 128 tokens for Maggie for 6,000 TG's = 46.88 TG's a token
256 Maggie Tokens for 10 radio's = 256 tokens for Maggie for 6,000 TG's = 23.43 TG's a token
If you waited TG rotation 8 times to get the hero you want you'd spend 6400 TG's buying "Maggie" tokens. Yes I understand it's not always guaranteed you'd get that hero (or any hero for that matter) but the point I'm trying to say and I hope @Shteevie takes note here. You have 6 possible outcomes when it comes to paying 10 radio's for a specific hero. 2 of them are more costlier than the TG shop rate (0,8). One is slightly better than the TG shop rate (32). 2 are much better but since NG doesn't tell anyone the odds, I feel, it's not worth the gamble since we haven't a clue of the odds.
I've used this analogy before but if I buy a scratchoff I can view the New York Lottery website and find the odds of receiving a winner overall, and the odds of receiving a winner at each individual reward ($1 purchase, odds of $1 winner, $5 winner, $10 winner, $20 winner, $100 winner, $500 winner etc.)
Now this isn't something you can collect with data but maybe use some type of comparison for.
We are used to 1 radio calls giving minimum of 2 with 1 choice.
We are used to 5 radio calls giving minimum of 8 with 2 choices.
We are used to 15 radio calls giving minimum of 32 with 3 chioces.
We are used to 10 radio calls giving minimum of 0 with 2 choices. And I would assume NG is used to hearing us complain about not getting proper pulls etc.
If the hero calls were in line with what we're used to maybe it would be more successful. use 5 radio (instead of 10) giving a minimum of 8 (instead of 0) with 2 choices. Getting 0 or 8 tokens when spending 10 radios is a huge dissapointment. Getting 32 tokens makes us feel excited (because we expect 32 tokens to drop from 15 radio pulls) but the cost of TG's compared to radio's and tokens it's not that big a deal. We're after the 128 and the 256 and I don't expect everyone to pull those everytime.
*edit - realized it's impossible to get 2 Maggie Tokens from the hero event radio call... still possible to get 0 though lol
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Further, you are not taking into account the point of the hero week itself - the chance to get a given hero is significantly increased. You can spend an equal number of phones making 10- and 15-phone calls, and you are on odds to end up with significantly more tokens of the specified hero using the 10-phone calls. We see a wide variety of results from around the forums about the things players get with their pulls, and you can take them all into account. You don't need to believe me for it to be true that the special calls are both better than the previous set, and better for getting the specified hero than even a 15-phone call is. This system is built to allow players to unlock and upgrade heroes slowly, so that each step of increase is appreciated, and the characters can each have a turn being special in the calls and also in the roster. If we just handed out 128-token results 50% of the time, people would still complain.
It's up to you how you use your phones. Or don't use them, if you are waiting for a rainy day. If you don't care who you get, make the 15s.
Please note: Development is a fluid process, and suggestions and implementation take time and iteration. Any discussion of future features, deadlines, updates, balance changes, and such should be considered prospective and subject to change.
Our company policy fits the industry standard of keeping our algorithms and databases to ourselves. It allows us more flexibility to fix bugs, alter events for later use, and to stay flexible when planning for future content. Besides, a player who is unwilling to trust us in the statement of "better chance for tokens" isn't going to be swayed by a table of numbers.
Please note: Development is a fluid process, and suggestions and implementation take time and iteration. Any discussion of future features, deadlines, updates, balance changes, and such should be considered prospective and subject to change.
I think the frustration here is that no one is asking for algorithms, but simply the percentage increase in getting a given hero through these events. Many games do this. Next Games even does this.... This weekend is Warrior weekend! Warrior damage is increased by 50%! You don't say Warrior damage is better this weekend!
And it's not necessarily that players aren't willing to trust you, it's just that 'better chance' could mean a 5% better chance or it could be a 50% better chance, Either way the statement is true, but only one of those percentage increases is worth my time... the other isn't. Disclosing the increased percentage chance would absolutely sway players one way or the other.
But it’s not the better wolf that wins. It’s the one you feed.
Contact [email protected] or send @Bill_ZRT a message to join DTP today!
During the last hero event, our radio collection data had hero tokens dropping at 30% in the special call (we didn't have enough data from each specific hero day to find the increased drop rate for each specific hero.) From 65 regular 5x radio calls, hero tokens dropped at about 10% rate. 15x radio calls dropped hero tokens at 12.7%, so we definitely saw an increase in hero drop frequency from our smaller sample.
You can check out all the radio call data collection from the history of the game here: https://twdnomansland.wordpress.com/radio-call-drop-rates/
And we are still collecting data that will be added to that page in the future.
YouTube Channel
It's different when one is related to an item that is directly for sale [phones]. We know from experience that divulging these numbers doesn't help the success of the event.
Additionally, it's quite a bit more complicated than a simple percentage increase, and trying to boil it down to averages might be seen as misleading. There is more than one die roll when you make a radio call.
Please note: Development is a fluid process, and suggestions and implementation take time and iteration. Any discussion of future features, deadlines, updates, balance changes, and such should be considered prospective and subject to change.
I firmly believe in transparency as the best way, both when it comes to a video game and with other matters in life.
It wouldn't remove conspiracy theories here on the forum but it would reduce them.
That said, it's always better to have events that are immidiately visible. F. ex I always thought the ICELS event had a huge weakness because many people never felt they never got anything (if they had bad RNG luck). A better option would have been to cut the price to 10 radios from 15 and keep the odds unchanged. Then people could see what they get.
Check out the DMZ guild. We're recruiting. Here.
As for your second point - there must be some way to represent the increase in both an accurate and transparent way that will make sense to your players. Without knowing your algorithms (which I'm still not asking for!) I can't make a suggestion here, but there must be a way. Even if it's to disclose just one of the 'numbers'. For example, perhaps you could disclose how much more likely is it that I get a specific hero during this event but leave the number of tokens I may or may not get out of the announcement.
But it’s not the better wolf that wins. It’s the one you feed.
Contact [email protected] or send @Bill_ZRT a message to join DTP today!
Where does that math ever work out in the real world when buying in larger quantities and bulk?
1 radio = 600 tg's in the store
So a 15 radio call cost = 9000 tg's
---------------------------------------
Token cost by a 15 Radio call
32 tokens for a rare srvr: 9000 / 32 = 281 tg's per token
128 tokens for an epic srvr: 9000 / 128 = 70 tg's per token
256 tokens for a legendary srvr: 9000 / 256 = 35 tg's per token
That's only if you decide to cash in the srvrs for tokens
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Token costs in the trade store
8 tokens cost: 600 / 8 = 75 tg's cost per token
30 tokens cost: 2500 / 30 = 83 tg's cost per token
I've learned my lesson: stay away from these 10-radio call events.
That being said, I am very happy that the 15-radio calls have been adjusted to remove 1* and 2* hero results. Thank you, NG!
Luck is not on my side it seems.
I'm going to stay on 15x calls from now on.
Elder of Retribution guild
I was going to call it a win and i accidentally hit another 15 radio pull instead of the x .... and had a come to jesus moment...
Boosted the first trait too
This games rng hates me.
& I really want Maggie!! :-/
Fingers & Toes crossed I have better Luck on Glenn & Abraham Days!!!
There Are However.. Plenty of Stupid Answers!!
Rhonda