Why I'm quitting Guild Challenges...

OneLessTitanOneLessTitan Member Posts: 1,273
Radios have always been the most premium of currencies IMO, but when Tokens and Radios were added to the Trade Good Shop, Trade Goods may have overtaken them as the most premium of currencies. Here’s why I’m quitting Challenges…for the most part. Challenges have gotten pretty boring for me. I know a lot of people like to play them for leaderboard purposes or guild camaraderie, or whatever other reason. This thread isn’t meant to tell you how to play; I believe you should do what makes you happiest in the game. For me, this is why I will be earning very few stars from now on, and will instead be only playing Raids for the most part.

First, I’m using the following assumptions in this math:
1. My average TG per Raid is 450. It’s not a perfect figure, but I’m not going to my Outpost Logs. I also realize lower level players get less TGs per Raid.
2. This analysis does not factor Bonus Stars from quests. That makes the differences slightly less drastic, but not by much.

So, if I average 450 Trade Goods per Raid, that equates to 225 Trade Goods per Gas. If I compare the Trade Goods (and factor in potential Radios earned) per gas, this what the math shows.

Explanation of columns:
Stars: The # of stars needed for the reward
TG Reward: The # of Trade Goods given for that specific individual star reward
Missions: The # of missions it takes to achieve that reward (not including bonus stars)
Gas Spent: The # of gas spent to achieve that reward
TG/Gas: How many Trade Goods you earn per 1 Gas
TOT TG: How many Total Trade Goods you’ve earned for reaching that reward
Raid TG: How many Trade Goods you would have got spending that gas on Raids
TG DIFF: The difference in Trade Goods between Raiding vs Challenges

Now, you may be wondering, what the hell is this radio crap? I’m glad you asked. You can obviously get Radios as rewards from post-mission crates, as well as Team Guild Rewards. So, I’ve tried to account for this.

I based these figures based on the data I’ve collected over many months. From 1000’s of missions played, I’ve found the following figures:

What this means is that of my total available crates, 3% were Gold Crates, 15% were Silver, and 82% were Bronze (column 2). I’ve found Radios in 5% of Bronze crates (column 3), but a lower % in Silver & Gold Crates. But, I put every % chance of a radios at 5% for each crate type just to make it simpler, so the Radio figures may actually be high. The Radio Crate% is the chance that the crate you open will be radios. The “Radios” Column just states how many Radios you get in each crate type. The “eRadios” column states how many “expected radios” you would get per crate, .062 Radios being how many Radios you’d expect from every crate, so about 1 Radio every 19-ish crates, or 1 Radio every 6+ missions you run without watching videos or spending gold.

Back to the original table, here’s what the following columns represent:
Crates: how many post-mission crates you’d open by achieving each reward.
eRadios Crates: how many “Expected Radios” you’d get by opening that many crates.
Team Stars: how many stars your guild would achieve if all 20 members each earned the star reward
Team Radios: how many Radios you’d get from Guild Rewards
TOT eRadios: “Team Radios” + “Team Radios”, or Total “Expected Radios”
Net TG-Radios: This column takes the “TG DIFF” column, and subtracts the Trade Goods that you would spend in the Trade Good Store to buy the # of “Total Expected Radios” when those Radios cost 600 Trade Goods per Radio. This column calculates the total difference of Trade Goods you get after you spend Trade Goods getting the same # of Radios you’d get from playing Challenges, or the real difference in Trade Goods between playing Raids vs. Challenges.

As you can see, the difference is pretty huge. Perhaps you’re wondering about the difference between the XP, Food, & Gold that you’d get from this comparison. I don’t have that data, but I can make some educated guesses. I average about 10,000 XP per Raid, or 5,000 XP per Gas. I don’t think I can earn nearly that much XP per gas in challenge missions. Food is a little tougher to calculate; you definitely earn more food from post-mission crates in challenges vs raids, but if you want food, you can always use Glenn in Leader position (which also makes sense since he’s a Scout….hint, hint). You could also make up for some of that lost food by purchasing Gold crates in the TG store. You definitely lose out on some Gold from the post-mission crates since there’s no direct way to get Gold from Raids, but could get some from Gold/Silver TG Crates.

For me, the main reason for playing challenge missions was to get to the RSL 20+ missions to have a super rare chance at Epic/LEG gear. But I can just buy that gear with all the extra TG I get from raiding. I know this isn’t for everyone, but if you are looking to maximize certain aspects of your game (when not on a Gas Booster), this may be the way to go for you.


  • wrinkled_bagwrinkled_bag Member Posts: 713
    I dropped out of my guild for the same reason. Challenge missions are a waste of gas and time. Outpost offers longer playing time and more enjoyment.
  • blynknzblynknz Member Posts: 1,988
    But its the challenge. You have to play the challenge so you can, uh,,,, um...

    Yeah, there is no reason to play the challenge. Maybe do it every so often to gauge the current strength of your squad.
  • Shut_UpShut_Up Member Posts: 2,295
    Grest stuff. I hope they don't take radios out of the trade shop!
  • OneLessTitanOneLessTitan Member Posts: 1,273
    jester said:

    What about hospital time per gas in outposts and challenges?

    For me....
    Hospital Time from Raids = 11 minutes at most per 2 gas, unless it's my last mission and I feel like going for influence on a tough TG crate location.
    Hospital Time from Challenges = a lot when the missions get super high

    @capibara -- like everything, sharing "info" is something I'm willing to risk. If NG wants to nerf outpost rewards, it's game over. If they want to buff Challenge rewards (or change the entire system), then I may start playing them again.

    @blynknz -- lol, my checks must have been sent to the wrong address.
  • Tapatio75Tapatio75 Member Posts: 636
    I only play challenges We-Th. Then xp missions
  • NecroboogieNecroboogie Member Posts: 1,108
    @Tapatio75 no,no! That's not the way! your not listening to all @OneLessTitan has to say...if you wanna know, how to get the TGs thou, it's in his lists, it's in his lists...

    Think you get it... if not

    Put in your own lyrics...
  • lincsixlincsix Member Posts: 34
    the generally idea of the game is FUN and competion !

    If you go on with mathematics where to spend gas and time to get the most radios or tradegoods the you have failed the sence of a game.

    for my example i should work 1 hour more each day in real life an buy all the stuff for real bugs - that would be my best time/gas/money ratio to boost my survivors ;)
  • SlickRickSlickRick Posts: 2,731

    My middle name is budget...and not winning
    You better check yo self before you wreck yo self...cuz I'm bad for your health, I come real stealth
  • Tapatio75Tapatio75 Member Posts: 636
    @Necroboogie I will try, it's kinda shoop shoop these days
  • PerdtinPerdtin Member Posts: 783
    SlickRick said:

    My extensive data analysis and internal number crunching with the Oakland Athletics sabermetrics department lead to the following conclusion:

    Put interrupt back and drop good gear in side missions

    Admittedly our published research documents with the Caltech mathematics department were quite rudimentary when compared to the honors we've won for our work in analysis, number theory, and quantum physics

    @SlickRick Whoa, you are Billy Beane? That is so cool. Can you get me good tickets? Not to the A's of course since Moneyball sort of has not been great in terms of W.S. wins... ;)
  • HershelsheadHershelshead Member Posts: 126
    I barely had enough time to read all the explanations, my hat is off to anyone who took the time to study this and then write it out for all to see. I will say, while you were typing I think I found 3 radios. Lol.
  • IpshaiIpshai Member Posts: 38
    Problem is challenge is repetitive and boring up until your final stars. But best way to get TG in outposts is rushing to trade goods with scout. There can be nothing as boring and repetitive as sprinting for TG.

    Most important thing is why do you level up weapons and survivors ? My goal is to try for as many stars as I can. I hope you play outposts to reach highest levels. If not, you need to explain why you bother upgrading your stuff at all.
  • jimmydawisejimmydawise Member Posts: 69
    Great job @OneLessTitan !!!

    So basically we should stop playing challenges after obtaining 15 stars and start raiding for optimal use of gas to obtain TG?
  • stolenstolen Member Posts: 46
    By pure rational economics it's definitely correct. By using between 100 and 120 daily gas one can gain between 25,000 and 30,000 tg by rough calculating. You can purchase all tg store offering and 1 or 2 high level leg. gear a day. Best return indeed. But what will you do with all those best survivors and gear .Unfortunately for this rational economical decision making, pushing challenges up is the most thrilling thing in this game.So for one who doesn't buy gas busters it's a difficult situation.
  • Conan1976Conan1976 Member Posts: 758

    .... impressive Work..... new stuff to think About. Maybe ill make a combi; daytime stars, evening TG's
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  • MadPuppyMadPuppy Member Posts: 2,831

    This thread isn’t meant to tell you how to play; I believe you should do what makes you happiest in the game.

    I think this is an immportant part of OLT´s post.

    Being very economical about which missions to play is not my thing for instance. I just do what I feel like when logging in. I only raid hard for TG when there's something in the store I really want and don't have TG for at hand.

    I do however have my own approach to upgrading buildings, which is strongly economics based. (Though far more simple than the above magnum opus).

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