NG gave refunds in the past. Why not now?
Artisans
Member Posts: 729
@Shteevie , I'd really appreciate an answer as to why a refund could be given in the past to Android users, but you keep saying it's not possible. Thank you in advance for replying.
Shadowkeeper Staff, Legendary Moderator
July 2016 edited July 2016
@Ruthless & anyone who asked about the Silenced trait.
The Silenced trait was indeed changed. The reason being, if you could combine that with Daryl's Silent Shot as a leader trait, it would be too powerful.
However, seeing as some of you bought a bundle with a weapon that has the Silenced trait, and that trait is now changed, we know that the weapon might no longer be the one that you wanted.
The trait was introduced in our update on June 28th. If you have bought a bundle with the Silenced trait since then, you can either contact our game support with the hashtag #silenced, attach a receipt of your purchase as well as a screenshot of the weapon in question, and we will compensate you with xp. Or if you want a refund, you can either contact us or Google Play to get it - unfortunately Apple users should contact Apple directly, as we can't handle Apple refunds.
This should have been communicated beforehand; sorry for the inconvenience
Shadowkeeper Staff, Legendary Moderator
July 2016 edited July 2016
@Ruthless & anyone who asked about the Silenced trait.
The Silenced trait was indeed changed. The reason being, if you could combine that with Daryl's Silent Shot as a leader trait, it would be too powerful.
However, seeing as some of you bought a bundle with a weapon that has the Silenced trait, and that trait is now changed, we know that the weapon might no longer be the one that you wanted.
The trait was introduced in our update on June 28th. If you have bought a bundle with the Silenced trait since then, you can either contact our game support with the hashtag #silenced, attach a receipt of your purchase as well as a screenshot of the weapon in question, and we will compensate you with xp. Or if you want a refund, you can either contact us or Google Play to get it - unfortunately Apple users should contact Apple directly, as we can't handle Apple refunds.
This should have been communicated beforehand; sorry for the inconvenience
Retired, but not entirely dead.
"Really? Good luck with that!"
"Really? Good luck with that!"
8
Comments
1) The silenced trait was originally an intentional feature of the weapon, which was indicated by the presence of the Silenced trait on the weapon. It had an icon, help text, etc. "Silenced" was even in the name!
2) The change of the weapon was from one intentional state to another. For game balancing reasons [which I cannot personally speak to - it was before my time at NG], it was decided to edit the weapon in players' inventories away from the clearly-stated behavior of the weapon as it had existed.
In the case of the molotov, please consider the following:
1) The first version of the legendary weapon had underpowered traits. If players were worried that they would have a less-good version of the weapon than other players who bought it after them, we gave out free copies of the corrected weapon to everyone who bought one according to our event-tracking records. This makes sure that no one who didn't buy the molotov got a free one [unless there was a human error made, which is correctable].
2) The issue relating to bodyshots was a bug. There was never any messaging from us that this was intentional, and any theories or rationalizations made by players as to why it might have been were not supported by any words or actions made by anyone at the company.
3) The bodyshot behavior was unintentional. This is supported by the fact that the behavior is not referenced by any of the weapon's traits [especially considering that the bug duplicates the effects of the Piercing trait that already existed in the game], any marketing materials, social media or forums messages from us, and the several months of development work put forward to make Bodyshots a crucial balancing factor in end-game play.
4) The fix of the bug applies to all copies of the weapon across all rarities. There is no favoritism or punishment being directed at anyone based on which version of the weapon that they have.
5) None of the advertised features of the weapon were changed as a result of the fixing of the bodyshot bug. The attack power, traits, area of effect, etc. are all still what they were before, which shows that those values were and still are what was intended, and not set specifically as part of the balancing of a weapon that was secretly meant to never create bodyshots.
In the case of the silenced weapon, the game sold you something that it thought would be fair, and ended up being overpowered. Since we had to change the item away from the weapon that was advertised, it made sense that additional action needed to be taken.
In the case of the molotov, the change was to correct behavior that was never intended and represented a flaw in the game. Leaving the flaw in place would be damaging to the future game balance, and would obviate most of the other items, classes, heroes, and mechanics in the game. A team of 3 bottle-throwing survivors would be the best team in the game, hands down, and anyone who hadn't paid for those weapons would be at a permanent disadvantage. It is not hard to see why it was imperative that the bug was fixed and as soon as possible.
Since we did not sell the weapon on the basis of the bug that we didn't know existed until after the weekend was over, we are not in the same position where we have had to deliberately change the weapon away from the state in which it was advertised. Rather, we have fixed a bug that restored the intended game balance and allowed the game to continue to be fair for everyone, including the free players.
Software has bugs. Bugs need to be fixed. The weapon we advertised is the weapon you now have.
I appreciate the frustration, and I hope you can at least see the logic from our standpoint. I understand your case, and I have never tried to claim that it was invalid. I deeply wish I had caught the bug before the weapon went out, because then we wouldn't have had some players basing a purchase off of a bug that no one had reported to us that never should have existed in the first place.
Please note: Development is a fluid process, and suggestions and implementation take time and iteration. Any discussion of future features, deadlines, updates, balance changes, and such should be considered prospective and subject to change.
Message me on the forums or on Line (ID: jayztwdnml) if you're interested in joining the Mavericks family of guilds.
Youtube channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCGSePrANMyf_S_YKJyfJodg
Strategy compendium: https://forums.nextgames.com/walkingdead/discussion/41787/jayzs-nml-strategy-compendium
"Really? Good luck with that!"
I don't think that the weapon would be too good now, but this is part of the reason why the luck trait needed the decrease it got.
Please note: Development is a fluid process, and suggestions and implementation take time and iteration. Any discussion of future features, deadlines, updates, balance changes, and such should be considered prospective and subject to change.
The experience you had with the common and rare versions was buggy, too. If we had been alerted about it, or found it ourselves [the greater responsibility for finding bugs is ours, of course], we would have fixed it before the Legendary one was on sale.
If you weren't aware of the bug, and bought the weapon anyway, why are you upset that the thing you were sold is the thing that you received?
Please note: Development is a fluid process, and suggestions and implementation take time and iteration. Any discussion of future features, deadlines, updates, balance changes, and such should be considered prospective and subject to change.
> 4) The fix of the bug applies to all copies of the weapon across all rarities. There is no favoritism or punishment being directed at anyone based on which version of the weapon that they have.
Great. So all of them have been screwed with. Including rares. So in attempting to make the game balanced we all have a weapon that just looks kool but provides little damage. Awesome.
I based my purchase on a rare version of a weapon as released by the developers one month before date of purchase. In all reality,should I have to assume that anything released isn't working as NG intended? How am I to know what the developers envisaged?
I'll happily test stuff n thangs before release. Provide the development plans and I'll tell you if items match the developers expectations. A better idea though would be to properly test things in-house before release.
Mistakes will happen, every reasonable person excepts this. The difference this time is the one month time frame. Someone from NG had to have seen how the weapon was behaving. If not, why not?
@Shteevie, putting the onus on the player to report every suspected bug will only give you guys more work. With little or no information to base the performance of newly released items on, every post on the forum will just read, is this working right?, should item a do this?, should item b do that?
Power
"Really? Good luck with that!"
If you weren't aware of the bug, and bought the weapon anyway, why are you upset that the thing you were sold is the thing that you received?
I wasn't aware it was bugged. NG let me use it for one month.It can't be bugged. I bought the legendary version of my not-bugged item. NG tell me both versions are bugged. NG apply fix. The thing I now have is not the thing I bought.
I left out the bit about the trait % mistake as I had enough information when comparing the rare and legendary versions to spot this bug and report it.
Power
> @Artisans
> The experience you had with the common and rare versions was buggy, too. If we had been alerted about it, or found it ourselves [the greater responsibility for finding bugs is ours, of course], we would have fixed it before the Legendary one was on sale.
>
> If you weren't aware of the bug, and bought the weapon anyway, why are you upset that the thing you were sold is the thing that you received?
Because people were buying the weapon based off the previous weapons capablities. If one works one way, why would they assume an upgraded, pricier one would work any differently than being higher powered? Bugged or not. We aren't developers, we're consumers and base product quality off what is clearly stated and if possible, how it's predecessor behaves. Pretty simple.
So I understand and agree with almost everything you've said, @Shteevie, and I came to understand why the capability could not have been left as is. That said, at the time I bought it, I didn't think it was a bug and this behavior was exactly why I bought it. No other reason. I'm probably not going to bother trying for a refund myself, but the resistance here is starting to bug me. It's obvious some % of the purchases are like mine. Probably quite a lot of them, but I have no proof. My guess, however, is that sales of this bundle were surprisingly brisk for a joke weapon.
On a logic-legal basis you are doing just fine, but that doesn't make it the right thing to do.
> @R2runfast Not saying I agree with them, but I think their logic was: with Daryl's leadership trait, Silenced, and potentially Luck on both a survivor and a weapon, one could come close to a 100% guarantee that ranged attacks wouldn't attract any walkers. Add a good Scout with high Threat Reduction to the mix, and it's possible that Silenced could be overpowered because one could completely avoid future waves of walkers.
I understand this idea but the same goes for using michonne as a leader and any scout with 75% reduction and Luck as a survivor trait or weapon trait at level 6 luck (20%) gold luck (20%) and gold threat reduction (75%) and michonnes ability (16%) you can not tell me silenced was overpowered... Definate 100% threat reduction is the same as 100% no threat if not better.
Sure we promised you a 5 room house with a 2 car garage (after they receive full payment)
So, we had to make a few modifications to your house, it's now a 1 room pull behind trailer with a port-a-potty attached. We felt the initial house was 'too powerful'. And you do not get any money back, because, well...that's how we roll.
And that folks, sums up NG.
"Really? Good luck with that!"
When I wrote it, I didn't see it as an attack, as his analogy was completely off and I was making it more realistic to the situation at hand.
And I fail to see how it was cheerleading, but clearly your intentions are only to insult and belittle...
This goes way back to last year, with the nerfing of the pistol traits. It was a HUGE uproar, and that debacle is apparently being repeated.
Your insinuation about stalking is appalling, disgusting and off the mark. It was an attack, and a personal one at that.