So NG has decided that they're going to cash in on their "mistake"

First of all, I'd like to say that I'm normally the first guy to defend the changes NG makes that the player base doesn't like. A more balanced game is a more fun game, and any video game production company is a business first and a provider of entertainment second. But let me explain why the way they are dealing with the Reckoning situation is such a problem this time and so completely beyond the pale...

They are of course refusing any refunds for people that purchased the Reckoning because it did not make body shots, claiming that it was an unintended bug, and they are implying that the people that bought the Reckoning were intentionally exploiting. That is false, because we assumed a shred of competency on NG's part. How does such a glaring oversight go on for so long? Most of us consider that extremely unlikely. Then when you consider that the Reckoning is a real POS without body shot immunity, having a smaller hit area than that of a standard assault weapon and turning walkers into more dangerous flaming walkers, and that it's a fire weapon that doesn't utilize bullets, it was PERFECTLY VALID TO ASSUME THAT THE BODY SHOT IMMUNITY WAS INTENTIONAL. Regardless of whether it was "advertised", it was implied through more ways than one to be a feature, not an outlandish error. Turns out the misleading nature of this weapon was a trap for spending players.

And so what if this WAS the result of incompetence? Is that really any better? Does that somehow make it acceptable? Are we supposed to presume what's going on with their game mechanics when they themselves are so clueless? And as bad as that is, that's the OFFICIAL story; the BEST case scenario, which most of us don't buy anyway.

The question then becomes "don't they test changes before they roll them out?" and the obvious answer is "of course they do," and so that's why so many of us believe that this was an intentional scheme. In this world of corporate money-grubbing, considering the end result, which is NG unfairly enriching themselves, doesn't that seem likelier?... Absolutely. You would think that they would at the very least want to distance themselves from that image by offering a few refunds, when they are already making plenty of money with hundreds of legitimate bundles. Their unwillingness to take responsibility for their supposed blunder is only further evidence to the contrary.

Whether this was an accident or a deliberate deception, the results were the same.... Next Games lined their pockets at the expense of confused players. Just because the glitch was never "intended," the "intention" to profit off of it is very real and very inappropriate. If it was not intended you should be proving it by refunding the money you took from players that had faith in your abilities to administer a game.

I've heard a lot of people say that they are never watching an ad or buying anything in the store again, but that's not enough, because they still salivate over their number of daily logins. This is a poorly designed game anyway and I would encourage you all to remove it from your devices.

NG, it's been fun, but you're flagrant lack of respect for me and the rest of your consumer base has ruined the game. Before I go though, I thought it would be fun to showcase how great of a costumer I've been to you, so you can decide whether losing me, and many others like me, was worth the $17.

Here is every purchase I've ever made in TWD:NML -- http://m.imgur.com/a/eYghW

If you also feel that NG has abused your generosity and you won't be playing any more, post here, and hopefully together we can make them think twice before pulling such stunts in the future.

Finally, here is a link you can use to file a complaint with the Better Business Bureau: https://www.bbb.org/consumer-complaints/file-a-complaint/get-started ... and when you do, be sure to make it clear that this was an unsavory money grab, citing details, and not routine rebalancing.
Degreaseravelardez8N8MizTyantArtisansPowerUKSebiAvalon8Loewe1968Zardoxjester_radicsSCBMAAYHJAInspTurbinesFester17

Comments

  • JayZJayZ Member Posts: 3,740
    I don't want to undermine people that were screwed by the Reckonin' purchase. It's a really crappy situation, and it sucks that NG is unwilling to directly process refunds.

    However, I do want to play devil's advocate here very quickly: Is it really in NG's best interest to screw players like that?

    Given their past experiences with Rick's pistol, the spending freeze, etc., I'm sure NG realizes that there's a HUGE risk of losing customers in the future. It's hard to believe that NG would intentionally screw people over for one small payout at the risk of a LOT of future business.

    For the record: I watched those level 30 challenge videos and didn't notice that there were no body shots. I had no idea until the post on the forums, and I'm a level 58 player that earns 400+ stars every week. It's really unlikely, but not impossible, that NG genuinely didn't know.

    Again, I'm not saying that I agree 100% with NG on this particular issue. I do believe that NG did not maliciously sell this weapon with the intention of nerfing it. That being said, I think their stance on reimbursements is indefensible and shady.
    Proud member of Mavericks OG, a top 3 global GW and challenge guild.
    Message me on the forums or on Line (ID: jayztwdnml) if you're interested in joining the Mavericks family of guilds.

    Youtube channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCGSePrANMyf_S_YKJyfJodg
    Strategy compendium: https://forums.nextgames.com/walkingdead/discussion/41787/jayzs-nml-strategy-compendium
    atrainofficial
  • GoshinkiGoshinki Member Posts: 7
    > @JayZ said:
    > I don't want to undermine people that were screwed by the Reckonin' purchase. It's a really crappy situation, and it sucks that NG is unwilling to directly process refunds.
    >
    > However, I do want to play devil's advocate here very quickly: Is it really in NG's best interest to screw players like that?
    >

    No, it's not in their best interest... i totally agree with you! That's why I'm so stunned they didn't offer any refunds. The fact that they didn't is just damning to them.... before they denied me, I didn't think much of it.
    ATLAS-ZSebiSCBMAbiffley
  • MovadoMovado Member Posts: 863
    @Goshinki Your receipt link shows you're an Apple/iOS platform user. Did Apple somehow refuse you the refund request?
  • GoshinkiGoshinki Member Posts: 7
    edited January 2017
    > @Marcus6253 said:
    > I find it fascinating that so many people are so inclined to believe that NG set out from the beginning to deceive their customers and purposefully sell an upgraded legendary version of a weapon that had been in game as a rare item for over a month.
    >
    > Here is what I suspect happened and why this is not a nefarious plan by NG but rather a poor attempt to recover from a mistake at multiple levels.
    >
    >

    All very fair points, and I do see the logical progression there I was not aware of... but for them to turn around and blame the players instead of themselves is asinine, and has already proven to be a very bad PR decision. Also, there's no excuse for such a programming failure in the first place, not when it resulted in them getting a ton of free $$$.
  • TroubleManTroubleMan Member Posts: 423
    JayZ said:

    I don't want to undermine people that were screwed by the Reckonin' purchase. It's a really crappy situation, and it sucks that NG is unwilling to directly process refunds.

    I would advise any player upset by once again NG's unethical and borderline criminal behavior to contact either Apple or Google and process a refund directly through them. This is better for 2 reasons. 1. It directly involves the companies that DO care about players and their money. 2. After too many complaints, IOS and Google can pressure NG into changing their outright theft of player money for non-existent (or worthless) items.
    JayZ said:


    However, I do want to play devil's advocate here very quickly: Is it really in NG's best interest to screw players like that?

    Yes. They make a lot of money doing it.
    JayZ said:


    Given their past experiences with Rick's pistol, the spending freeze, etc., I'm sure NG realizes that there's a HUGE risk of losing customers in the future. It's hard to believe that NG would intentionally screw people over for one small payout at the risk of a LOT of future business.

    Not really. Take a look around. Sure there are several of us 'old' players from last summer when NG really went on a Sell/Nerf craze, but there are PLENTY of new marks just starting up that can't help themselves from buying overpriced items that will lose functionality as soon as NG has harvested enough profit for the item.
    JayZ said:


    For the record: I watched those level 30 challenge videos and didn't notice that there were no body shots. I had no idea until the post on the forums, and I'm a level 58 player that earns 400+ stars every week. It's really unlikely, but not impossible, that NG genuinely didn't know.

    Just. Stop. There. They knew. This is once again a concerted effort to defraud the customer. They sell an item, then literally hours after the sale....they nerf it. Only this time they got smart and blamed it on a 'bug'. As if throwing a Molotov cocktail would literally result in a 'reduced bodyshot'. Whatever. Next time they are going to sell an assault rifle, then the next day nerf it saying it was actually just loaded with blanks and it's really just a 500 gold club.
    JayZ said:


    Again, I'm not saying that I agree 100% with NG on this particular issue. I do believe that NG did not maliciously sell this weapon with the intention of nerfing it. That being said, I think their stance on reimbursements is indefensible and shady.

    I've got a bridge to sell you then....

    JayZMarcus6253OneLessTitankryptonixGoshinkiquitJOSHin
  • GoshinkiGoshinki Member Posts: 7
    > @Movado said:
    > @Goshinki Your receipt link shows you're an Apple/iOS platform user. Did Apple somehow refuse you the refund request?

    I have not tried yet but that's irrelevant. They shouldn't be passing the buck into the platforms that have no idea of the situation, and I shouldn't have to plead my case to them when this situation is so plainly wrong on its face.
    KillersZSlowMoPowerUK
  • TroubleManTroubleMan Member Posts: 423
    Degreaser said:

    Arguing about intent is a bit of a distraction. It's certainly much worse if it was intentional but there's no way for us on the outside to know.

    Agreed, so one must fall on past history to be the guide. NG has repeatedly sold items that are 'unique' and have very desirable traits....then once the 'limited time offer' is over....nerf the said product that was on sale.

    This is not a one-off, an accident, or a mistake. At this point, based on past history and continued behavior, it is now the NG business model.

    Buy anything in the store at your own risk.

    Can you imagine if an auto dealer tried the same tactic? You buy the car, drive it home and park it in the driveway. Next day wake up, with a note attached to the windshield. "Sorry, after purchase we determined that your vehicle was imbalanced. We've removed 2 wheels, and reduced the engine size by 50%. Cheers, and there are no refunds!"

    How long do you suspect that could go on? Not long, but because NG operates with digital goods it's A-OK...

    mongo911Survivor420
  • GoshinkiGoshinki Member Posts: 7
    Here is the exact response I got from them:

    http://imgur.com/a/rQoUa

    The insincerity of this canned response is enough to retch.... I love how if you assumed it was a bug, you're an "astute player", but if you didn't assume that, you're essentially being called a MORON.
    Survivor420
  • CaptainslayerCaptainslayer Member Posts: 1,430
    @JayZ I'm trying to agree with you, but the spending freeze was from a small amount of the players base and didn't include the majority of their 'whales' and judging by their decisions after the freeze was over ng basically didn't give a crap about it and not only went through with their plans but also added interupt to their upcoming nerfs.
    I've adopted the hakuna matata attitude now I've decided to never spend on this game again and I'll continue to play it and ignore all the bad things until I can't no longer
    Elder of dragons weyr a top USA guild
    JayZSurvivor420SCBMARedEye52
  • jesterjester Member Posts: 2,754
    Why do we call errors in coding a bug?
    SgtSalamiArtisansLoewe1968Survivor420
  • DegreaserDegreaser Member Posts: 72
    jester said:

    Why do we call errors in coding a bug?

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Software_bug#Etymology
    SgtSalamijester
  • jesterjester Member Posts: 2,754
    @Degreaser

    Wow. Dates back to 1878 at least.
  • quitJOSHinquitJOSHin Member Posts: 134
    edited January 2017
    @Goshinki
    There's no way they deliberately sold this weapon with the intention of nerfing it. The fallout from it is too huge and easily foreseeable and there's no way they would have done that on purpose.

    I'm sure the reason NG is not attempting to do a blanket refund for everyone directly is because the vast majority didn't even know about the bodyshots issue until they announced it as a bug. And I'm not so sure they even have the ability to do individual refunds. There is a very vocal minority that knew about the bodyshots and are up in arms about it and I'm sure there are also quite a few just jumping on the bandwagon in hopes of getting something free out of it. Not everyone deserves a refund. If you really did buy it only because of the bodyshots then go ahead and contact Apple or Google to get a refund like @Shteevie has already said here:

    http://forums.nextgames.com/walkingdead/discussion/comment/170488/#Comment_170488
    kryptonixSurvivor420TroubleMan
  • SebiSebi Posts: 146
    They've done it on purpose .I'm not stupid. They knew well about the no bodyshot .Why would I ever buy a weapon for money if it ain't better than the free one I have?Right now all my free assault weapons are better then the rekoning in any aspect.Range .Damage.plus they STUN. It is ilogic to buy the rekoning as it is now.We had the rare version for a MONTH !!! I knew firat day as I reached lvl 24 that it ain't bodyshooting. Based on that I bought the legendary one. I used experience and gold to up it and used it.It worked as I imagined it will. No surprise there!! I then found out they were giving a second one to players that bought it in the first hours.Knowing how powerful it is I was shocked to find this .Then they nerfed it exactly 48 hours after most bought it so players won't get refunds from Google play .I don't believe a word from them anymore. They conned hundreds of players. It was intentional and well planned! !!
    kryptonixSurvivor420quitJOSHinGoshinki
  • mongo911mongo911 Member Posts: 939
    NextGames, at this time, is a clusterF...

    I have never seen, sooooo many Bundles at one time ( to generate money )...

    I also read thru the " communication posts " from @Teeceezy, where at first it sounded that refunds were possible... Then the " rug was pulled out from his statement "

    The NextGames Company has problems... ( they bring their problems upon themselves... )

    @Teeceezy is just a messenger... ( yup... He got smacked down, by others... Crummy for him... )
    I am easily confused by other people's, laziness and sloppiness and greed...

    Any guess who might " now " be on my list, ( in 2017 )





    Survivor420SCBMAInspTurbines
  • GoshinkiGoshinki Member Posts: 7
    edited January 2017
    @quitJOSHin

    Like I said, it really doesn't matter if it was on purpose or not, because that's exactly how it appears. They made a ton of money doing it, and that's all the motivation they needed. I frankly don't think they care about the backlash, and that's exactly why we all need to STOP PLAYING, to make them rethink that.
    SCBMAInspTurbinesbiffley
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