I really just upgraded because that's what I do and have done since way back when Daryl was teaching me things. Now it's pretty amazing to see an instance where it was counterproductive. I don't recall Daryl covering that issue.
Yea I'm not happy with this balance progression either. It is definitely evident that they originally only planned things out till lvl 20. They have said that before, but even if they hadn't it's pretty obvious. They seem clueless on how to continue the game and keep our progress feeling rewarding.
On a side note: You can upgrade ONE survivor without it changing your starting level for challenges. I picked my overall favorite survivor and upgraded her and only her til I get good gear for all my survivors, or lose interest in the game altogether. Whichever comes first.
On a side note: You can upgrade ONE survivor without it changing your starting level for challenges. I picked my overall favorite survivor and upgraded her and only her til I get good gear for all my survivors, or lose interest in the game altogether. Whichever comes first.
I did that so I could get the flamethrower at level 21. But my scavenge missions are now 1 RSL higher, although the challenge is unchanged.
@TransmuteJun
Mine was an assault too so I got my lvl 21 flamethrower. And yeah it does raise your scavenge mission level but that doesn't bother me personally as much as the challenge missions. Something to consider though
So leveling 2 survivors from lvl 20 to lvl 21 is going to raise the starting level of chalanges from 14 to 15? Is this confirmed? Because i heard someone say you could upgrade two and still start on lvl 14. Can someone clear this one out for me? Thanks!
Starting Difficulty:
This is based on the levels of your top three survivors. The number of stars they have is not considered. Based on the levels of your team, you should see the following starting difficulties:
2 or more level 18 Survivors: Starting Difficulty 13
2 or more level 19 Survivors: Starting Difficulty 14
2 or more level 20 Survivors: Starting Difficulty 14
2 or more level 21 Survivors: Starting Difficulty 15
That was some excellent data gathering and analysis. For players that are pushing the limits of each week's challenge, upgrading from 20 to 21 will be more difficult.
However, Challenges are not the only activity in the game. There are additional things to consider: * Outpost offense and defense is easier if you are level 21. * Rewards in chests increase based on your survivor level. * You can only store so much experience before you have to spend it or lose it. * The progression curve may never return to the previous normal. Do you intend to stay at level 20 in perpetuity? * If the curve is 'fixed', then it will immediately reward players who have already completed the level 21 upgrade. It will take a long time (or a lot of gold) to catch up.
You would think this would be fixed solely from a business perspective? At the end of the day it all about making $$$$$. If there is no incentive to upgrade, then there is no incentive to buy bundles.
This is the only game I know it is detrimental to upgrade. In restrospect if I had known I wouldn't have wasted my time in upgrading
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It's not worth it to me. Pushing higher in challenges is the only thing in the game that interests me now. They can fix it or I can stay at 20, I don't mind either way.
Will I stay at 20 forever? Probably not. Eventually I'll stop playing altogether.
Bad Pig Bad to the bone! The Notorious P.I.G. "I'm stuck in forum prison, and time keeps draggin' on" "I’ve never said I’m a perfect pig, nor pretended to be someone that I’m not."
> * Outpost offense and defense is easier if you are level 21.
> * Rewards in chests increase based on your survivor level.
> * You can only store so much experience before you have to spend it or lose it.
> * The progression curve may never return to the previous normal. Do you intend to stay at level 20 in perpetuity?
> * If the curve is 'fixed', then it will immediately reward players who have already completed the level 21 upgrade. It will take a long time (or a lot of gold) to catch up.
I finally got my rep points down and don't care about outpost, only purchased chests are affected by survivor level (rest is rsl level or bp), I'm upgrading the equipment for 21 and will be a long time before I waste any, I'll stay at 20 till they fix this ridiculous mess, and then it will take me 2 days without spending money to get to 3 survivors at 21.
I'll sit with one level 21 and build for the day they fix it. I know it's "coming soon." if not I'll have almost a 100 star advantage over those that are getting screwed by this (which is completely unfair).
In a way, all of us has an El Guapo to face. For some, shyness might be their El Guapo. For others, a lack of education might be their El Guapo. For us, El Guapo is a big, dangerous man who wants to kill us.
Bad Pig Bad to the bone! The Notorious P.I.G. "I'm stuck in forum prison, and time keeps draggin' on" "I’ve never said I’m a perfect pig, nor pretended to be someone that I’m not."
Pretty sure the reason the devs and the CEO have been relatively amiss in the forum lately is because they have all been busy around the boardroom table, for days now, trying to manufacture yet another "believable" excuse for this debacle. Considering they have just gone public on the stock market with their recent IPO one would think that they should actually, finally care about customer opinion. Here's mine...
As @kiwinz7 said, I've also never seen another game where upgrading is detrimental and I'm a first generation video gamer. I've been playing games since PONG.
* The progression curve may never return to the previous normal. Do you intend to stay at level 20 in perpetuity?
No, but I think I will focus on upgrading gear to lvl24 and start upgrading more survivors to 21 only when I have a great set of weapons and armor for my main team.
I'm glad we're still talking about this. I play for maximum challenge stars. It was the only way to demonstratably show the strength of your survivor crew. Well at least before 2.5. Sadly I didn't realize I'd been punked until I had 3 survivors upgraded.
What makes it worse, seeing my high star count which is unobtainable for months. It's a shame that wasn't wiped clean as well.
Finishing this weeks challenge with 100+ less stars than I could achieve prior to upgrading my survivors to level 21. Less rewards and less stars for my guild as punishment for upgrading. Very frustrated. Certainly was not able to get any further in the challenge than last week level wise and just got less rewards for my efforts. What game punishes you for upgrading!
I knew prior this thread was started, that there is no good reason in raising my survs to lvl21, so I trained only Abe to get that nice flamethrower at lvl21. I already have about 10 pieces of gear upgraded to lvl24, but I´ll wait till point a) NG will fix that or b) I´ll have 2 great sets for each class. It is really ridiculous, that upgrading ones survs will bring disadvantage in challenge stars hunt and I hope @NG will come to their sences and fix that ASAP.
Top guilds are losing top players, NG is hurting the players that spend money (only way to get 21s that fast, so they know who they affected), and we are being told this is intended. I honestly don't get it. It's an easy fix, make the 21 upgrades comparable to the other 19 in the game. It isn't a large request, and it should be an easy fix. People are upset about starting a round later, but that is equal across the levels. At least that makes sense and is fair. Everyone is upset about the level 21 survivor and equipment upgrade (as much of everyone as can be assumed from the players left). Honestly this is worse than the huge mistake they made with rsl start levels, and they saw the results and fixed that. Why is this still an issue?
In a way, all of us has an El Guapo to face. For some, shyness might be their El Guapo. For others, a lack of education might be their El Guapo. For us, El Guapo is a big, dangerous man who wants to kill us.
For a long time I shaved with a razor that had 3 blades. I had a nice stockpile of 3 bladed razors. Then, the razor company released a razor with 4 blades!! Sure, it cost more, but it had to be better, right? So I bought a bunch of 4 bladed razors, but i didn't get as good of a shave. I felt ripped off, so I went back to using the razor with 3 blades.
How about a demote a survivor one level at a time feature?
This is clearly counter to NGs interest since they are now accountable to stockholders, and a slave to their bottom line. Unfortunately for NG, they have lost a lot of future income from endgamers since no rational person will be spending more $ on future council upgrades, but the plus for them is that a new sucker is born every minute in this business. Customer ignorance accounts for a large portion of revenue in this industry, so do yourself a favor, research your investments in games like you would any other purchase; the information is out there, and if you can't find it, ask. Companies rely on the mindset of "oh this is just a game so I'll just impatiently play and everything will work out great for me!"
Nobody ever thought that it might be intented to give newer players the chance to compete?
There was the infamous job offer talking about player life value and how to squeeze out as much as possible. The last update worked fine from that point of view: the veteran players rushed to upgrade their stuff and paid for it. The not already maxed out players are able now to score as high or even higher as players with survivors +1 level and are motivated to keep playing (and spending).
So it was a win-win update from NGs pov. For me as a player there is no benefit. Ony if there would have been new content especially new story missions. The only part of the game where a higher level of survivors/gear was needed to succeed (after the human enemy buff).
And do not tell me that raiding/defending outposts is easier with upgraded stuff. It was easy before the update and it still is. No matter if you are using 20s or 21s.
From my point of view the game was designed and planned to end at lvl 20 back in the days. Everything that came after that was improvised and was no improvement...
I disagree that this update was a win/win for NG. Many of the top performers have spent to get there only to be downgraded in challenges by this upgrade.
As far as I see it NG will lose many of those players.
Is there any reason to upgrade from level 19 to 20?
Of course. Going from 19 to 20 makes your survivors better at story missions, scavenging, outposts, and episode missions without making them worse at challenges. By contrast, going from 20 to 21 makes them better at other game modes, but worse at challenges.
Bad Pig Bad to the bone! The Notorious P.I.G. "I'm stuck in forum prison, and time keeps draggin' on" "I’ve never said I’m a perfect pig, nor pretended to be someone that I’m not."
In a way, all of us has an El Guapo to face. For some, shyness might be their El Guapo. For others, a lack of education might be their El Guapo. For us, El Guapo is a big, dangerous man who wants to kill us.
It will be a long time for me because I have so many other things to upgrade first I like to upgrade my whole camp, weapons and armor before I jump my srvrs up another level
Comments
That's also why survivor upgrade costs have more than doubled (995k or something around that from 19 to 20 vs. 1.97m from 20 to 21).
Makes sense?
Yes, sure, totally makes sense...
Morbid Survivors are looking for you! If you are looking for a new guild, PM me.
On a side note: You can upgrade ONE survivor without it changing your starting level for challenges. I picked my overall favorite survivor and upgraded her and only her til I get good gear for all my survivors, or lose interest in the game altogether. Whichever comes first.
Mine was an assault too so I got my lvl 21 flamethrower. And yeah it does raise your scavenge mission level but that doesn't bother me personally as much as the challenge missions. Something to consider though
http://forums.nextgames.com/walkingdead/discussion/24720/challenge-starting-level-changes-announcement
Starting Difficulty:
This is based on the levels of your top three survivors. The number of stars they have is not considered. Based on the levels of your team, you should see the following starting difficulties:
2 or more level 18 Survivors: Starting Difficulty 13
2 or more level 19 Survivors: Starting Difficulty 14
2 or more level 20 Survivors: Starting Difficulty 14
2 or more level 21 Survivors: Starting Difficulty 15
However, Challenges are not the only activity in the game. There are additional things to consider:
* Outpost offense and defense is easier if you are level 21.
* Rewards in chests increase based on your survivor level.
* You can only store so much experience before you have to spend it or lose it.
* The progression curve may never return to the previous normal. Do you intend to stay at level 20 in perpetuity?
* If the curve is 'fixed', then it will immediately reward players who have already completed the level 21 upgrade. It will take a long time (or a lot of gold) to catch up.
This is the only game I know it is detrimental to upgrade. In restrospect if I had known I wouldn't have wasted my time in upgrading
Will I stay at 20 forever? Probably not. Eventually I'll stop playing altogether.
Bad to the bone!
The Notorious P.I.G.
"I'm stuck in forum prison, and time keeps draggin' on"
"I’ve never said I’m a perfect pig, nor pretended to be someone that I’m not."
> * Rewards in chests increase based on your survivor level.
> * You can only store so much experience before you have to spend it or lose it.
> * The progression curve may never return to the previous normal. Do you intend to stay at level 20 in perpetuity?
> * If the curve is 'fixed', then it will immediately reward players who have already completed the level 21 upgrade. It will take a long time (or a lot of gold) to catch up.
I finally got my rep points down and don't care about outpost, only purchased chests are affected by survivor level (rest is rsl level or bp), I'm upgrading the equipment for 21 and will be a long time before I waste any, I'll stay at 20 till they fix this ridiculous mess, and then it will take me 2 days without spending money to get to 3 survivors at 21.
I'll sit with one level 21 and build for the day they fix it. I know it's "coming soon." if not I'll have almost a 100 star advantage over those that are getting screwed by this (which is completely unfair).
Bad to the bone!
The Notorious P.I.G.
"I'm stuck in forum prison, and time keeps draggin' on"
"I’ve never said I’m a perfect pig, nor pretended to be someone that I’m not."
No, but I think I will focus on upgrading gear to lvl24 and start upgrading more survivors to 21 only when I have a great set of weapons and armor for my main team.
I'm glad we're still talking about this.
I play for maximum challenge stars. It was the only way to demonstratably show the strength of your survivor crew. Well at least before 2.5. Sadly I didn't realize I'd been punked until I had 3 survivors upgraded.
What makes it worse, seeing my high star count which is unobtainable for months. It's a shame that wasn't wiped clean as well.
It is really ridiculous, that upgrading ones survs will bring disadvantage in challenge stars hunt and I hope @NG will come to their sences and fix that ASAP.
How about a demote a survivor one level at a time feature?
This is clearly counter to NGs interest since they are now accountable to stockholders, and a slave to their bottom line. Unfortunately for NG, they have lost a lot of future income from endgamers since no rational person will be spending more $ on future council upgrades, but the plus for them is that a new sucker is born every minute in this business. Customer ignorance accounts for a large portion of revenue in this industry, so do yourself a favor, research your investments in games like you would any other purchase; the information is out there, and if you can't find it, ask. Companies rely on the mindset of "oh this is just a game so I'll just impatiently play and everything will work out great for me!"
YouTube Channel
There was the infamous job offer talking about player life value and how to squeeze out as much as possible. The last update worked fine from that point of view: the veteran players rushed to upgrade their stuff and paid for it. The not already maxed out players are able now to score as high or even higher as players with survivors +1 level and are motivated to keep playing (and spending).
So it was a win-win update from NGs pov. For me as a player there is no benefit. Ony if there would have been new content especially new story missions. The only part of the game where a higher level of survivors/gear was needed to succeed (after the human enemy buff).
And do not tell me that raiding/defending outposts is easier with upgraded stuff. It was easy before the update and it still is. No matter if you are using 20s or 21s.
From my point of view the game was designed and planned to end at lvl 20 back in the days. Everything that came after that was improvised and was no improvement...
Just my 2 cents.
Many of the top performers have spent to get there only to be downgraded in challenges by this upgrade.
As far as I see it NG will lose many of those players.
Bad to the bone!
The Notorious P.I.G.
"I'm stuck in forum prison, and time keeps draggin' on"
"I’ve never said I’m a perfect pig, nor pretended to be someone that I’m not."
It will be a long time before I consider taking them up to level 21
I like to upgrade my whole camp, weapons and armor before I jump my srvrs up another level