The combat code is actually more complicated than I will state it here, but in concept, it's really much simpler.
Crit Chance = minimum of: (base chance + luck + accurate + Sure Shot or Powerstrike + Carol), (90%)
This is a case where Luck works differently than it does for other Traits. Until this portion of the discussion occurred, I hadn't realized that this specific point of confusion existed. For that oversight, I apologize. I guess this might be the result of being too close to the issue.
Development Team Member - The Walking Dead: No Man's Land Please note: Development is a fluid process, and suggestions and implementation take time and iteration. Any discussion of future features, deadlines, updates, balance changes, and such should be considered prospective and subject to change.
Geez, now I'm even more confused than I was before. @Shteevie, are you saying that the order in which these traits affect each other are as you stated, or are you saying that they all work together? In other words, since you have luck listed 2nd, does that mean that it affects base crit, but then only after that accurate/SS/PS/Carol stack on top of it? Or is the order in which you listed them completely irrelevant, and luck affects them all - i.e., (base crit + accurate + SS/PS + Carol) + [(base crit + accurate + SS/PS + Carol)*luck]? Sorry if my question is as confusing as your answer - I'm not always great at putting math into words
PS: I am not even considering the 90% cap in this question - I don't think that's relevant to the issue I'm seeking clarification on. I understand that if all of those traits add up to a crit >90%, then you're stuck with the 90% cap.
Board-certified slayer of the dead Proud elder of Dead Stalkers
To try (as hard as I can) to be more succinct, are saying it is: (base crit * luck) + (accurate + SS/PS + Carol) = total crit?
Or is it:
(base crit + accurate + SS/PS + Carol) + [(base crit + accurate + SS/PS + Carol)*luck]?
Hopefully I didn't screw up my "equations" to just make things worse, and hopefully you understand what I'm trying to ask. If not, please keep the conversation going with @jimmorrison369, because he is light years better at this than I am
Board-certified slayer of the dead Proud elder of Dead Stalkers
Yep, looking up at @jimmorrison369 's equations, I clearly f'd mine up. Just friggin ignore me, I can't do this, smh. Screw it, I'm just gonna go all assault on every map
Board-certified slayer of the dead Proud elder of Dead Stalkers
> @Shteevie said: > The combat code is actually more complicated than I will state it here, but in concept, it's really much simpler. > > Crit Chance = minimum of: (base chance + luck + accurate + Sure Shot or Powerstrike + Carol), (90%) > Daryl's leader trait needs to be added in this calculation also
Crit Chance = minimum of: (base chance + luck + accurate + Sure Shot or Powerstrike + Carol), (90%)
@Shteevie, 1) What is the base chance equal to and how it depends on the zombie level? 2) Is Luck in the formula the Luck as is, e.g. 10% (15%, etc)? 3) Is there in your formula a place for crit chance badges?
@Shteevie thx much, that makes sense and aligns with what I thought it was, ‘simple’ stacking of all crit chances (base, luck, accurate, ss/ps, carol/daryl).
Edit: forgot luck, added
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1) What is the base chance equal to and how it depends on the zombie level? 2) Is Luck in the formula the Luck as is, e.g. 10% (15%, etc)? 3) Is there in your formula a place for crit chance badges?
1) This is where I have to draw the line at for now; this number is one we'll be keeping private for now. 2) Yes, you simply add it to other things that increase crit; in this one case, there is no multiplication. 3) Daryl's trait, Crit Badges, etc all add on as well, in the same way.
@DBones Is it okay if I don't ignore you? I understand now that there was a lot more confusion than I was aware of, and I hope that your gameplay is more fun now that you know.
Development Team Member - The Walking Dead: No Man's Land Please note: Development is a fluid process, and suggestions and implementation take time and iteration. Any discussion of future features, deadlines, updates, balance changes, and such should be considered prospective and subject to change.
Ahhhh......This is REALLY helpful information. Thanks to everyone involved in this conversation, particularly @jimmorrison369, @Putchuco, and @Shteevie.
Oh, and no thanks at all to that dolt, @DBones, who should've smoked a lot less before Mrs. Giordano's algebra class back in high school.
Board-certified slayer of the dead Proud elder of Dead Stalkers
@jimmorrison369 after what is now known , can we provide an example in this thread of a survivor with gear and traits + badges and how the calculation goes please ?
I used to be a number cruncher in this game back in simpler times when gold luck + Gold dodge + Gold luck on survivor + Gold dodge on survivor = 80% dodge on all enemies . But this thread is very confusing for most how to apply all of this to their teams
Again, @Kaz@Shteevie this is great, pls don't stop sharing and discussing these kind of things.
I have taken the liberty to update my previous summary with the latest information. Didn't want to take this away from anyone else, just didn't see anyone else doing it.
Maybe this helps others as well, as I found that helpful info was still spread over various posts here.
If it helps, great. I you don't find it helpful, forget it.
LUCK in the game
As a rule of thumb: LUCK increases the probability of triggering other probability traits, i.e. any trait that has a '% chance' to be triggered.
One BIG exception: Piercing is NOT influenced by Luck. Piercing changes the values used for the game's calculation of whether an attack is a Body Shot or not. It is not a new effect with a chance to happen. This is why Piercing is not affected by Luck.
List of traits that are affected by Luck: - Bullet Dodge - Charging - Concussion - Critical Chance - Dodge - Incendiary - Interrupt - Silenced - Stun Resistance - Swift Strike - Threat Reduction
Any Trait that reads like "X% of the time, do an awesome thing" is affected by Luck. Any Trait that reads like "Some other number is increased or decreased by X%" is not affected by Luck.
To find out how much Luck helps, add together the Luck values from weapon, survivor, and Gabriel's Traits [whichever are applicable, of course]. Then, increase the percentage of the trait in question by the amount of luck you have. Be careful; this is not the same as just adding the trait and Luck together. If you have a 50% chance on the Trait, and 20% luck, you add 20% of the 50% to the original 50% to get 60%.
The math form of this looks like this: (Trait %) x (1 + (total luck %)) = final trait %
Critical Chance with Luck
In contrast to other traits, Luck adds % directly to the chance of a critical shot/hit.
Crit Chance = minimum of {(base chance + luck + accurate + Sure Shot or Powerstrike + Carol or Daryl), (90%)}
(we assume base chance to be around 10%, higher when fighting lower level of the opponents. This is not officially confirmed)
NOTE: Luck does increase a survivor's Critical Chance, but doesn't increase the Accurate, Sure Shot or the Power Strike traits per se.
Calculation examples: - If you have 20% of Dodge on your armor and 20% of Luck, the formula goes like this: Dodge + (Dodge x Luck) = 20 + (20 x 0.2) = 24% of total chance for Dodge to kick in - If you have 20% of Dodge on your armor plus 20% of Dodge on your survivor and 20% of Luck, then it'll be 40% of dodge and therefore the formula would be: 40 + (40 -x 0.2) = 48% - If you have 20% of Dodge plus 20% of Luck on your weapon and 20% of Luck on your survivor, then it goes like this: 20 + (20 x 0.4) = 28%
For the Leader traits, it depends on the Hero, so Luck affects only: - Silent Shot (Daryl's) - Good Out of Bad (Sasha's) - Mysterious Ways (Gabriel's) - Thinning The herd (Michonne's) - Second Chance (Carl's) - Bodyguard (Jerry's) - Aim For The Head (Carol's) - Mullet Time! (Eugene's) - Defensive Charge (Morgan's)
It should be noted that many Leader Traits are 2 smaller things stuck together. Luck affects things that happen or not based on a percentage chance, not things that always increase some other number by a percentage.
In Jerry's case, for instance, Luck causes it to happen more often, but doesn't increase the amount of damage reduction. In Gabriel's case, the chance to dodge is affected by Luck, and the Luck he adds himself adds on to other Luck the Survivors may have.
Also also also, each survivor's luck is added up separately. If Carol has lucky gear, that helps her, but not the others on her team. Similarly, her teammate's Luck helps the benefit of Carol's leader trait, but only for them, and not for Carol.
- Luck on a Hero ONLY affects them, NOT any of the team members - Luck on a team member (either directly or weapon) adds to the probability of a (probability-based) hero-trait to kick in for THEM (!)
Capped traits
NOTE: The Luck trait doesn't increase the chance of a trait that is already capped.
NG hopes that the worst offenders in terms of 'cap' have been dealt with, and they say they know better than to flirt with these kinds of imbalances again in the future.
Critical chance is capped at 90% Damage Reduction is capped at 80% Stun Resistance is capped at 75%
There is one exception to the damage reduction cap - in the turn that a Survivor is prevented from dying by Carl's "Second Chance" trait, they will take 0 damage for the remainder of the enemy turns. This way, the player has time to get the survivor to safety before they are in danger again.
If you would like to join a drama-free and fun group of enthusiasts, contact us via email at [email protected]
@Putchuco Base chance of critical chance also depends on the lvl difference. When fighting low level walkers, you'll have critical hits all the time. (without the need for "xtra" critical chance.) When fighting high level walkers, it is capped at a minimum of 10% probably..
@Putchuco, in your crit-chance calculation, you should also include badges (as @Shteevie mentioned above). Thanks for compiling everything like this!
Good point, we shouldn’t forget about the badges. I’m not a super fan of +crit chance badges myself, and maybe i’m wrong on that, but they surely help. Thx
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Comments
Where exactly does Luck influence Crit Chance, esp when it comes to Accurate/Sure Shot/Power Strike
We might as well get it 100% right while we are at it
contact us via email at [email protected]
2 possibility's
Critical chance = (base crit + accurate + sureshot/powerstrike) * (1 + luck/100%)
Or
Critical chance = (base crit) * (1 + luck/100%) + accurate + sureshot/powerstrike.
I really hope it is the first one. ( That one includes those traits)
Crit Chance = minimum of: (base chance + luck + accurate + Sure Shot or Powerstrike + Carol), (90%)
This is a case where Luck works differently than it does for other Traits. Until this portion of the discussion occurred, I hadn't realized that this specific point of confusion existed. For that oversight, I apologize. I guess this might be the result of being too close to the issue.
Please note: Development is a fluid process, and suggestions and implementation take time and iteration. Any discussion of future features, deadlines, updates, balance changes, and such should be considered prospective and subject to change.
PS: I am not even considering the 90% cap in this question - I don't think that's relevant to the issue I'm seeking clarification on. I understand that if all of those traits add up to a crit >90%, then you're stuck with the 90% cap.
Proud elder of Dead Stalkers
(base crit * luck) + (accurate + SS/PS + Carol) = total crit?
Or is it:
(base crit + accurate + SS/PS + Carol) + [(base crit + accurate + SS/PS + Carol)*luck]?
Hopefully I didn't screw up my "equations" to just make things worse, and hopefully you understand what I'm trying to ask. If not, please keep the conversation going with @jimmorrison369, because he is light years better at this than I am
Proud elder of Dead Stalkers
Proud elder of Dead Stalkers
> The combat code is actually more complicated than I will state it here, but in concept, it's really much simpler.
>
> Crit Chance = minimum of: (base chance + luck + accurate + Sure Shot or Powerstrike + Carol), (90%)
>
Daryl's leader trait needs to be added in this calculation also
1) What is the base chance equal to and how it depends on the zombie level?
2) Is Luck in the formula the Luck as is, e.g. 10% (15%, etc)?
3) Is there in your formula a place for crit chance badges?
If you have 40% luck and there is 10% base critical. Total will be 50%.
Where other traits have a relative increase. Critical has an absolute increase in %.
Wow, it does explain some tests where I found 90% crit chance, but couldn't explain it.
‘simple’ stacking of all crit chances (base, luck, accurate, ss/ps, carol/daryl).
Edit: forgot luck, added
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So not critical * (1 + luck/100%)
But critical + luck.
That makes it even better.
contact us via email at [email protected]
2) Yes, you simply add it to other things that increase crit; in this one case, there is no multiplication.
3) Daryl's trait, Crit Badges, etc all add on as well, in the same way.
@DBones
Is it okay if I don't ignore you? I understand now that there was a lot more confusion than I was aware of, and I hope that your gameplay is more fun now that you know.
Please note: Development is a fluid process, and suggestions and implementation take time and iteration. Any discussion of future features, deadlines, updates, balance changes, and such should be considered prospective and subject to change.
Luck is the way to go!
Only reason to have accurate when you want both. But in all other instance. Luck = accurate, but it is also much more.
Oh, and no thanks at all to that dolt, @DBones, who should've smoked a lot less before Mrs. Giordano's algebra class back in high school.
Proud elder of Dead Stalkers
I used to be a number cruncher in this game back in simpler times when gold luck + Gold dodge + Gold luck on survivor + Gold dodge on survivor = 80% dodge on all enemies . But this thread is very confusing for most how to apply all of this to their teams
I am contemplating making something in strategy section. I'll ask to sticky it.
Won't be today though.
I have taken the liberty to update my previous summary with the latest information.
Didn't want to take this away from anyone else, just didn't see anyone else doing it.
Maybe this helps others as well, as I found that helpful info was still spread over various posts here.
If it helps, great. I you don't find it helpful, forget it.
LUCK in the game
As a rule of thumb: LUCK increases the probability of triggering other probability traits, i.e. any trait that has a '% chance' to be triggered.
One BIG exception: Piercing is NOT influenced by Luck.
Piercing changes the values used for the game's calculation of whether an attack is a Body Shot or not. It is not a new effect with a chance to happen. This is why Piercing is not affected by Luck.
List of traits that are affected by Luck:
- Bullet Dodge
- Charging
- Concussion
- Critical Chance
- Dodge
- Incendiary
- Interrupt
- Silenced
- Stun Resistance
- Swift Strike
- Threat Reduction
Any Trait that reads like "X% of the time, do an awesome thing" is affected by Luck. Any Trait that reads like "Some other number is increased or decreased by X%" is not affected by Luck.
To find out how much Luck helps, add together the Luck values from weapon, survivor, and Gabriel's Traits [whichever are applicable, of course]. Then, increase the percentage of the trait in question by the amount of luck you have. Be careful; this is not the same as just adding the trait and Luck together. If you have a 50% chance on the Trait, and 20% luck, you add 20% of the 50% to the original 50% to get 60%.
The math form of this looks like this:
(Trait %) x (1 + (total luck %)) = final trait %
Critical Chance with Luck
In contrast to other traits, Luck adds % directly to the chance of a critical shot/hit.
Crit Chance =
minimum of {(base chance + luck + accurate + Sure Shot or Powerstrike + Carol or Daryl), (90%)}
(we assume base chance to be around 10%, higher when fighting lower level of the opponents. This is not officially confirmed)
NOTE: Luck does increase a survivor's Critical Chance, but doesn't increase the Accurate, Sure Shot or the Power Strike traits per se.
Calculation examples:
- If you have 20% of Dodge on your armor and 20% of Luck, the formula goes like this: Dodge + (Dodge x Luck) = 20 + (20 x 0.2) = 24% of total chance for Dodge to kick in
- If you have 20% of Dodge on your armor plus 20% of Dodge on your survivor and 20% of Luck, then it'll be 40% of dodge and therefore the formula would be: 40 + (40 -x 0.2) = 48%
- If you have 20% of Dodge plus 20% of Luck on your weapon and 20% of Luck on your survivor, then it goes like this: 20 + (20 x 0.4) = 28%
For the Leader traits, it depends on the Hero, so Luck affects only:
- Silent Shot (Daryl's)
- Good Out of Bad (Sasha's)
- Mysterious Ways (Gabriel's)
- Thinning The herd (Michonne's)
- Second Chance (Carl's)
- Bodyguard (Jerry's)
- Aim For The Head (Carol's)
- Mullet Time! (Eugene's)
- Defensive Charge (Morgan's)
It should be noted that many Leader Traits are 2 smaller things stuck together. Luck affects things that happen or not based on a percentage chance, not things that always increase some other number by a percentage.
In Jerry's case, for instance, Luck causes it to happen more often, but doesn't increase the amount of damage reduction. In Gabriel's case, the chance to dodge is affected by Luck, and the Luck he adds himself adds on to other Luck the Survivors may have.
Also also also, each survivor's luck is added up separately. If Carol has lucky gear, that helps her, but not the others on her team. Similarly, her teammate's Luck helps the benefit of Carol's leader trait, but only for them, and not for Carol.
- Luck on a Hero ONLY affects them, NOT any of the team members
- Luck on a team member (either directly or weapon) adds to the probability of a (probability-based) hero-trait to kick in for THEM (!)
Capped traits
NOTE: The Luck trait doesn't increase the chance of a trait that is already capped.
NG hopes that the worst offenders in terms of 'cap' have been dealt with, and they say they know better than to flirt with these kinds of imbalances again in the future.
Critical chance is capped at 90%
Damage Reduction is capped at 80%
Stun Resistance is capped at 75%
There is one exception to the damage reduction cap - in the turn that a Survivor is prevented from dying by Carl's "Second Chance" trait, they will take 0 damage for the remainder of the enemy turns. This way, the player has time to get the survivor to safety before they are in danger again.
contact us via email at [email protected]
contact us via email at [email protected]
Base chance of critical chance also depends on the lvl difference.
When fighting low level walkers, you'll have critical hits all the time. (without the need for "xtra" critical chance.)
When fighting high level walkers, it is capped at a minimum of 10% probably..
How would you estimate base crit chance above body shot limit?
contact us via email at [email protected]
I'm not a native english speaker, so pls let me know if something sounds funky.
Thx to all for the contributions, awesome example of teamwork!
contact us via email at [email protected]
Critical chance base chance:
RSL + 3
10%
RSL 0
40%
RSL - 5
90%
I'm not sure about the exact numbers.
I’m not a super fan of +crit chance badges myself, and maybe i’m wrong on that, but they surely help.
Thx
contact us via email at [email protected]
- Silent Shot (Daryl's)
Your team’s reared attacks have ＊＊% chance of not creating threat and ＊＊% better critical chance.
Is Lucky suitable for both?
Actually, lucky boosts critical chance.
Daryl's silent shot also boosts critical chance.
So lucky only boosts the "silence" part.
The crit part is more working in synergy with luck.